Discussion:
Countdown to Full-scale Dictatorship Worldwide [WONT BE LONG NOW !]:
(too old to reply)
Special Care
2009-08-25 10:59:01 UTC
Permalink
$1000 Per Day Fine And 30 Days In Jail For Refusing The Swine Flu
Vaccine In Massachusetts.
http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-in-jail-for-refusing-the-swine-flu-vaccine-in-massachusetts

The Vaccination Fraud (Rattigan / Mendelsohn)
http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_126hgz9s8fb

Animal Experimentation: the Hidden Cause of Environmental Pollution
http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_174g5kg85dn

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LAST THROW OF THE DICE IN 1990 /
HUMANITY'S LAST CHANCE /
THE LOST OPPORTUNITY OF 1990:
The Only Sane Response to the Vivisection Swindle (1990):
http://www.nzavs.org.nz/mobilise/27/12.html
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-08-25 12:28:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
$1000 Per Day Fine And 30 Days In Jail For Refusing The Swine Flu
Vaccine In Massachusetts.http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-...
The Vaccination Fraud (Rattigan / Mendelsohn)http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_126hgz9s8fb
Animal Experimentation: the Hidden Cause of Environmental Pollutionhttp://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_174g5kg85dn
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LAST THROW OF THE DICE IN 1990 /
HUMANITY'S LAST CHANCE /
The Only Sane Response to the Vivisection Swindle (1990):http://www.nzavs.org.nz/mobilise/27/12.html
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Do you remember Polio? Would you prefer that the polio vaccine had
not been invented and then administered on a global scale?
Special Care
2009-08-25 12:37:20 UTC
Permalink
On Aug 25, 1:28 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Special Care
$1000 Per Day Fine And 30 Days In Jail For Refusing The Swine Flu
Vaccine In Massachusetts.http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-...
The Vaccination Fraud (Rattigan / Mendelsohn)http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_126hgz9s8fb
Animal Experimentation: the Hidden Cause of Environmental Pollutionhttp://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_174g5kg85dn
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------
LAST THROW OF THE DICE IN 1990 /
HUMANITY'S LAST CHANCE /
The Only Sane Response to the Vivisection Swindle (1990):http://www.nzavs.org.nz/mobilise/27/12.html
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------
Do you remember Polio?  Would you prefer that the polio vaccine had
not been invented and then administered on a global scale?
==============

Extract from
"Vaccination - Assault on the Species"
by Pat Rattigan ND:

------

"Polio

Even during an epidemic, the wild polio virus produces no discernible
symptoms in over 90 percent of those exposed to it. 33 This, of
course, has not stopped the vaccine boys et al propagating the myth
that whole populations are in grave danger of paralysis if they are
not ‘protected’.

‘The number of reported cases of polio following mass inoculations
with the killed live virus vaccine was significantly greater than
before mass inoculations and may have doubled in the US…’ 13
In the late 1940s it was noticed that diphtheria vaccination was
leading to paralytic polio. A government inquiry found that over one
third of cases of paralytic polio in children under the age of two
occurred within three months of diphtheria vaccination. 34

‘Millions of people have been inoculated with the anti-polio vaccine
contaminated with the tumoral virus SV 40, which in origin was present
in the monkeys.’ Prof J Clausen, Institute of Preventative Medicine,
Odense, Denmark. Up to 500 million people may have received the
vaccine which was cultivated on the kidneys of the green monkey. 45

Dr F Klinner commented: ‘Many here voice a silent view that the Salk
and Sabin vaccines, being made of monkey tissue, have been directly
responsible for the major increase of leukaemia in this country.’

In the Lancet a report stated ‘Outbreak of paralytic poliomyelitis in
Oman...among fully vaccinated children.’ 35

Whilst the sane mind might expect that the vaccine might be declared
harmful or, at least, useless, and withdrawn, the vaccine combine had
a better idea. What was really needed was more vaccination.
Recommendations were to increase the dose at birth and at 6, 10 and 14
weeks of age with additional doses when other vaccines were given.

According to the US Centres for Disease Control, Feb 1992: ‘from 1980
thru 1989, every case of polio in the US (excluding imported cases)
was caused by the vaccine.’

Being near to a polio-vaccinated baby can be a major risk. An English
professor at Cornell University, Bernard Reis, was paralysed by polio
a month after the vaccination of his child. Kay McNeary was awarded
$1.1 million after being crippled by polio after changing her baby's
nappy."

-----------
Apart from anything else, if you look at the graph showing the decline
in the incidence of polio in UK in the twentieth century, it is clear
that introduction of mass vaccinations had no effect on the trend.
-----------
As a general rule, disease is prevented by hygiene, meaning avoidance
of poisons, and other healthy lifestyle choices.
There is no money to be made from a healthy population.
Poisonous vaccines and other "animal tested" [=untested] pollutants
generate more and more disease, which means more and more profits for
the Vivisection Syndicate.
-----------
The Vaccination Fraud (Rattigan / Mendelsohn)
http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_126hgz9s8fb
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-08-25 13:01:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Aug 25, 1:28 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Special Care
$1000 Per Day Fine And 30 Days In Jail For Refusing The Swine Flu
Vaccine In Massachusetts.http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-...
The Vaccination Fraud (Rattigan / Mendelsohn)http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_126hgz9s8fb
Animal Experimentation: the Hidden Cause of Environmental Pollutionhttp://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_174g5kg85dn
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------
LAST THROW OF THE DICE IN 1990 /
HUMANITY'S LAST CHANCE /
The Only Sane Response to the Vivisection Swindle (1990):http://www.nzavs.org.nz/mobilise/27/12.html
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------
Do you remember Polio?  Would you prefer that the polio vaccine had
not been invented and then administered on a global scale?
==============
Extract from
"Vaccination - Assault on the Species"
------
"Polio
Even during an epidemic, the wild polio virus produces no discernible
symptoms in over 90 percent of those exposed to it. 33 This, of
course, has not stopped the vaccine boys et al propagating the myth
that whole populations are in grave danger of paralysis if they are
not ‘protected’.
‘The number of reported cases of polio following mass inoculations
with the killed live virus vaccine was significantly greater than
before mass inoculations and may have doubled in the US…’ 13
That comes from a blog written by Pat Rattigan self described as:
[Pat Rattigan is a qualified naturopath of 30 years experience, a
teacher, qualified at secondary and adult level and trained at primary
level : also a trained and qualified machine shop engineer. He runs
the Nemesis network and the British Anti-Vivisection Association].

Anyone can write a blog and say anything they like. I notice that
this guy has no real scientific or medical qualifications. What you
cut and pasted is a series of self referencing animal rights blogs
with titles like "the great HIV hoax" etc. This is a series of
carefully selected facts taken out of context and being used to imply
what they never meant to begin with.

In 1950s Ireland, polio was rife. It is now more or less eliminated.
I have two close relatives who got it and they lived in clean suburban
semi detached houses and did not get it through bad lifestyle
choices. Are you really suggesting that the vaccine was a hoax? Are
you saying the vaccine has no effect? You seem to imply that the
numbers were declining at such a rate that it would have eliminated
itself?

That graph you mention to back that up is a hand drawn graph from
another animal rights blog written by a psychologist. Anyone can do
that just by making stuff up. Can you find a real scientific
reference published in the real medical or scientific literature to
back up that remarkable claim?
Omega
2009-08-25 13:25:57 UTC
Permalink
On Aug 25, 1:28 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Special Care
$1000 Per Day Fine And 30 Days In Jail For Refusing The Swine Flu
Vaccine In
Massachusetts.http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-...
The Vaccination Fraud (Rattigan /
Mendelsohn)http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_126hgz9s8fb
Animal Experimentation: the Hidden Cause of Environmental
Pollutionhttp://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_174g5kg85dn
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------
LAST THROW OF THE DICE IN 1990 /
HUMANITY'S LAST CHANCE /
The Only Sane Response to the Vivisection Swindle
(1990):http://www.nzavs.org.nz/mobilise/27/12.html
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------
Do you remember Polio? Would you prefer that the polio vaccine had
not been invented and then administered on a global scale?
==============
Extract from
"Vaccination - Assault on the Species"
------
"Polio
Even during an epidemic, the wild polio virus produces no discernible
symptoms in over 90 percent of those exposed to it. 33 This, of
course, has not stopped the vaccine boys et al propagating the myth
that whole populations are in grave danger of paralysis if they are
not 'protected'.
'The number of reported cases of polio following mass inoculations
with the killed live virus vaccine was significantly greater than
before mass inoculations and may have doubled in the US.' 13
That comes from a blog written by Pat Rattigan self described as:
[Pat Rattigan is a qualified naturopath of 30 years experience, a
teacher, qualified at secondary and adult level and trained at primary
level : also a trained and qualified machine shop engineer. He runs
the Nemesis network and the British Anti-Vivisection Association].

Anyone can write a blog and say anything they like. I notice that
this guy has no real scientific or medical qualifications. What you
cut and pasted is a series of self referencing animal rights blogs
with titles like "the great HIV hoax" etc. This is a series of
carefully selected facts taken out of context and being used to imply
what they never meant to begin with.

In 1950s Ireland, polio was rife. It is now more or less eliminated.
I have two close relatives who got it and they lived in clean suburban
semi detached houses and did not get it through bad lifestyle
choices. Are you really suggesting that the vaccine was a hoax? Are
you saying the vaccine has no effect? You seem to imply that the
numbers were declining at such a rate that it would have eliminated
itself?

That graph you mention to back that up is a hand drawn graph from
another animal rights blog written by a psychologist. Anyone can do
that just by making stuff up. Can you find a real scientific
reference published in the real medical or scientific literature to
back up that remarkable claim?



Polio vaccine only became 'safe' when 'duck egg' vaccine was introduced
... the early polio vaccines sometimes caused the vaccinated to contract
the disease .... with that early history of polio vaccination it
would certainly worry me if forced to take a vaccine for any diseaese with a
more or less untested vaccine

As an aside, my partner a senior nurse, was pursuaded to have a flu jab a
couple of seasons ago due to the nature of nursing work so, it was thought,
key NHS staff wouldn't lose time off with flu and therefore weaken the
resources to help others in their need ... partner had the jab then
within days spent a fortnight off with flu then went back to work totally
exhausted for several weeks! ... some vaccine heh? ... yes! I
caught the bloody infection too, thank you NHS

omega
martin
2009-08-25 13:53:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Omega
As an aside, my partner a senior nurse, was pursuaded to have a flu jab a
couple of seasons ago due to the nature of nursing work so, it was thought,
key NHS staff wouldn't lose time off with flu and therefore weaken the
resources to help others in their need ... partner had the jab then
within days spent a fortnight off with flu then went back to work totally
exhausted for several weeks! ... some vaccine heh? ... yes! I
caught the bloody infection too, thank you NHS
You DO realise there is no virus in the vaccine and it's impossible to
catch flu from it? Dunno why you blame the NHS, blame the wife for
working around infected people. More ignorance from a fuckwit who
doesn't know what he's talking about.
Post by Omega
omega
martin
2009-08-25 13:49:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
On Aug 25, 1:28 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
$1000 Per Day Fine And 30 Days In Jail For Refusing The Swine Flu
Vaccine In Massachusetts.http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-...
The Vaccination Fraud (Rattigan / Mendelsohn)http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_126hgz9s8fb
Animal Experimentation: the Hidden Cause of Environmental Pollutionhttp://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_174g5kg85dn
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------
LAST THROW OF THE DICE IN 1990 /
HUMANITY'S LAST CHANCE /
The Only Sane Response to the Vivisection Swindle (1990):http://www.nzavs.org.nz/mobilise/27/12.html
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------
Do you remember Polio? Would you prefer that the polio vaccine had
not been invented and then administered on a global scale?
==============
Extract from
"Vaccination - Assault on the Species"
------
"Polio
Even during an epidemic, the wild polio virus produces no discernible
symptoms in over 90 percent of those exposed to it.
Shame noone bothered to tell Ian Dury
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
[Pat Rattigan is a qualified naturopath of 30 years experience, a
teacher, qualified at secondary and adult level and trained at primary
level : also a trained and qualified machine shop engineer. He runs
the Nemesis network and the British Anti-Vivisection Association].
Well, it makes for a good conspiracy I suppose, I don't know what their
reasoning is for the total eradication of small pox from the entire
world (baring two labs).

It's always non-medical people who seem to think they know more about
epidemiology than scientists and doctors. A mechanic for crying out
loud. Yet the same bloody blog gets posted again and again and copied
and replicated. Why don't the kooks reference Nature of something? Ah,
big science bad, idiot mechanic good.
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
That graph you mention to back that up is a hand drawn graph from
another animal rights blog written by a psychologist. Anyone can do
that just by making stuff up. Can you find a real scientific
reference published in the real medical or scientific literature to
back up that remarkable claim?
Don't be daft lol of course he hasn't.
Old Jinglebollocks
2009-08-25 13:58:16 UTC
Permalink
 Can you find a real scientific
Post by martin
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
reference published in the real medical or scientific literature to
back up that remarkable claim?
Don't be daft lol of course he hasn't.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Science is a religion.
Old Jinglebollocks
2009-08-25 14:14:30 UTC
Permalink
Actually, the original post was about something else - the fact that
compulsory medication is another nail in the coffin of the bit of
freedom and democracy some regions of the world had until the rot set
in in the 1970s.
EU membership had some befefits but it is the death knell of democracy
as we knew it.

Compulsory medication, with the threat of bankruptcy and imprisoment
if you refuse to be poisoned, is part of the process of softening us
up for full-scale dictatorship.

The process is gathering pace now, as if there is a timetable.

2012?

It can't be stopped. There is nothing anyone can do about it. But if
we look at what is happening, it's a mind-enhancing, soul-stretching
experience. That's all, and that was the purpose of the original post.
Cat(h)
2009-08-25 22:37:29 UTC
Permalink
On Aug 25, 3:14 pm, Old Jinglebollocks
Post by Old Jinglebollocks
Actually, the original post was about something else - the fact that
compulsory medication is another nail in the coffin of the bit of
freedom and democracy some regions of the world had until the rot set
in in the 1970s.
EU membership had some befefits but it is the death knell of democracy
as we knew it.
Compulsory medication, with the threat of bankruptcy and imprisoment
if you refuse to be poisoned, is part of the process of softening us
up for full-scale dictatorship.
The process is gathering pace now, as if there is a timetable.
2012?
It can't be stopped. There is nothing anyone can do about it. But if
we look at what is happening, it's a mind-enhancing, soul-stretching
experience. That's all, and that was the purpose of the original post.
Jingle Bollocks indeed.

Caít()
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-08-25 15:33:59 UTC
Permalink
On Aug 25, 2:58 pm, Old Jinglebollocks
  Can you find a real scientific> > reference published in the real medical or scientific literature to
Post by martin
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
back up that remarkable claim?
Don't be daft lol of course he hasn't.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Science is a religion.
That is a misunderstanding; it explains why your attempts at proving
events and explaining phenomena lead you to make startling conclusions
(the ones you post here). You think the above because you treat
science as a religion. You seem to assume that the main way to
discovery things is to think about them. That is what religious
people do.
In Science, it is good to think a lot but on its own, thought alone
has lead to some notoriously silly and incorrect conclusions.

In Science, you can reach a conclusion by mathematical analysis or by
measurement but the most powerful method is to do experiments. If a
conclusion is not disprovable by an experiment then it is not science
but is indeed religion. For any theory or model to be considered
scientific, it must be possible to design a good experiment that could
prove it to be false, if it is indeed false. This is often held to be
the distinguishing feature of science. Religion can only be
"disproved" with enormous difficulty. Once you allow for the
possibility of miracles, it becomes impossible. Any theory that can
never be disproved by anything is not scientific.
Special Care
2009-08-25 17:44:17 UTC
Permalink
On 25 Aug, 16:33, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
....your attempts at proving
events and explaining phenomena lead you to make startling conclusions
(the ones you post here).  
-----------------------------------------------

Well, if you mean all of the serious posts, not just this page - I was
trying to be helpful.

If we argue about a subject like vaccines, it's possible to go on
forever with no progress being made.

That is why I tried to identify some core essentials which cannot be
disputed, as an analysis of the way we are, and an indication of the
way to heal the world.

For an example of an indisputable core essential - you can't get past
pages 9 to 11 of "Slaughter of the Innocent / Imperatrice Nuda" by
Hans Ruesch, showing that animal tests have no predictive value for
the effect a substance has on human beings, and that therefore fake
animal tests [=non-tests] are the immediate cause of environmental
pollution, and furthermore the forces of our profit-driven economy
guarantee that the level of pollution will keep on getting worse until
there is a global public health crisis and the fatal poisoning or
infertility of the food chain, leading to widespread famine and
disease and the collapse of civilisation. That is clear to anyone who
thinks it through. That the human species has a collective death wish
is beyond dispute. Yet the book which is most helpful at explaining
that aspect of our condition - "Mankind in Amnesia" by Immanuel
Velikovsky - is out of print and not being debated realistically.

Another core essential, for those who read most of what I write, is
the sexual nature of the mother-infant relationship, and the impulse
of growing children to imitate and repeat early formative experiences,
which makes nonsense of our concepts of what child abuse and
paedophilia really are (although I don't advocate any immediate change
in the way we deal with babies). The fact that human beings do not
remember their infancy, and have no interest in recovering those
memories of the formative time that makes us what we are - that is
quite shocking when you think about it.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

I try not to think about such things some of the time, and to enjoy
myself a bit. But we all feel very uneasy now. We all know something
is wrong. This entity called the human species is collectively
mentally ill and out of control, and no one can do anything about it.
We feel powerless. One person or group has no ability to make any
meaningful changes. The ruling group are perhaps even more frightened
by the lack of control, as they have more to lose. That was the
purpose of the numerically vast scale of human and animal "sacrifice"
in 'biblical' times - the ruling group were terrified of losing their
power and wealth in another collapse of civilisation, so they tried to
appease the angry 'gods' by killing for them pre-emptively. It never
worked.

Well, these are some thoughts that come to mind.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-08-25 18:02:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On 25 Aug, 16:33, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
....your attempts at proving
events and explaining phenomena lead you to make startling conclusions
(the ones you post here).  
-----------------------------------------------
Well, if you mean all of the serious posts, not just this page - I was
trying to be helpful.
If we argue about a subject like vaccines, it's possible to go on
forever with no progress being made.
That is why I tried to identify some core essentials which cannot be
disputed, as an analysis of the way we are, and an indication of the
way to heal the world.
For an example of an indisputable core essential - you can't get past
pages 9 to 11 of "Slaughter of the Innocent / Imperatrice Nuda" by
Hans Ruesch, showing that animal tests have no predictive value for
the effect a substance has on human beings, and that therefore fake
animal tests [=non-tests] are the immediate cause of environmental
pollution, and furthermore the forces of our profit-driven economy
guarantee that the level of pollution will keep on getting worse until
there is a global public health crisis and the fatal poisoning or
infertility of the food chain, leading to widespread famine and
disease and the collapse of civilisation. That is clear to anyone who
thinks it through. That the human species has a collective death wish
is beyond dispute. Yet the book which is most helpful at explaining
that aspect of our condition - "Mankind in Amnesia" by Immanuel
Velikovsky - is out of print and not being debated realistically.
Another core essential, for those who read most of what I write, is
the sexual nature of the mother-infant relationship, and the impulse
of growing children to imitate and repeat early formative experiences,
which makes nonsense of our concepts of what child abuse and
paedophilia really are (although I don't advocate any immediate change
in the way we deal with babies). The fact that human beings do not
remember their infancy, and have no interest in recovering those
memories of the formative time that makes us what we are - that is
quite shocking when you think about it.
The above is NOT science; it is opinion. Your "core essentials" are
beliefs.
These are not only disputable, they are scientifically silly. The
most scientific claim is the one concerning the limits to animal
testing. That is provable and measureable or it is not. It is well
known that there are differences between mammals regarding how they
respond to e.g. drugs. There are also great similarities. If you
test a drug on an animal and it causes no ill effects then that does
not prove it is safe for humans and that is well known. It just
proves that it has passed that hurdle. You assume that the people
doing the testing and using the results of testing, know nothing about
physiology, molecular biology, genetics and chemistry and just pour
stuff over rabbits and stand back.
The Velikovsky stuff is nuts. This is a psychologist who made
fantastical claims about planets that collided with the earth by doing
psycho analysis on patients. The fact that it disagrees with all of
geology, physics and biology, is calmly ignored.
The mother and infant stuff is fanciful, unprovable and basically
invented.
Post by Special Care
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I try not to think about such things some of the time, and to enjoy
myself a bit. But we all feel very uneasy now. We all know something
is wrong. This entity called the human species is collectively
mentally ill and out of control, and no one can do anything about it.
We feel powerless. One person or group has no ability to make any
meaningful changes. The ruling group are perhaps even more frightened
by the lack of control, as they have more to lose. That was the
purpose of the numerically vast scale of human and animal "sacrifice"
in 'biblical' times - the ruling group were terrified of losing their
power and wealth in another collapse of civilisation, so they tried to
appease the angry 'gods' by killing for them pre-emptively. It never
worked.
Well, these are some thoughts that come to mind.
Special Care
2009-08-26 07:44:39 UTC
Permalink
On Aug 25, 7:02 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
The above is NOT science; it is opinion. Your "core essentials" are
beliefs.
These are not only disputable, they are scientifically silly.  The
most scientific claim is the one concerning the limits to animal
testing.  That is provable and measureable or it is not.  It is well
known that there are differences between mammals regarding how they
respond to e.g. drugs.  There are also great similarities.  If you
test a drug on an animal and it causes no ill effects then that does
not prove it is safe for humans and that is well known.  It just
proves that it has passed that hurdle.   You assume that the people
doing the testing and using the results of testing, know nothing about
physiology, molecular biology, genetics and chemistry and just pour
stuff over rabbits and stand back.
The Velikovsky stuff is nuts.  This is a psychologist who made
fantastical claims about planets that collided with the earth by doing
psycho analysis on patients.  The fact that it disagrees with all of
geology, physics and biology, is calmly ignored.
The mother and infant stuff is fanciful, unprovable and basically
invented.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

(1) No amount of detailed theoretical knowledge about physiology can
overcome the real "core essential" that so-called animal tests have
ZERO predictive value for the effect a substance has on humans. When
similarities are seen, that is not predictable until the substance is
tested on humans. The 'industrial boom' after world war two depended
for its profitability upon the marketing of millions of synthetic
poisons. The false 'animal tests' provided a smokescreen enabling us
to keep the truth at a distance - the truth that this unstoppable
avalanche of poisons represents a collective death wish.

(2) The geological record, especially in Alaska and Siberia (showing
that the scale of the destruction about eleven thousand years ago, and
later around 3,400 years ago, was clearly global in its impact, with
herds of tropical zone animals frozen within an hour, with tropical
grasses still in their mouths) - indicates a sudden change in the
earth's polar axis, and this in turn could have been brought about
only by the presence of a large 'rogue planet' very close to earth.
The supporting evidence is endless.

(3) I put myself in a strong debating position when I said I have
recovered (and partly never lost) the memories of the authentic
perceptions and impusles of the universal human infant. That enables
me to say to others: you don't remember your infancy, whereas I do, so
you have no right to make pronouncements about matters of which you
have no memory. The way to resolve that debate would be for everybody
to perform the Practical Reparenting exercises so as to recover the
memories of the authentic perceptions and impulses of human babies.
Such a venture would necessitate safeguards in the form of an
emotional safety net, a new type of intimate communal love and caring,
because the recovery of those memories of infancy may release powerful
suppressed emotions which our civilisation does not even acknowledge
to exist in this tragic era. In that way the journey and the
destination will fuse into one when we go down that road of recovering
the memories of infancy. It was not for nothing that Apollonius-Jesus
advised us to "become as little children," little meaning infants, in
the sense of recovering the pristine, primal love and sanity of the
universal infant.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

The world is becoming a more frightening place by the day. There does
seem to be a timetable to restore full-scale dictatorship worldwide
within a few years from now. This is part of our collective amnesia /
collective repetition compulsion, meaning our pathological urge to
recreate and relive the forgotten survivalist emergencies in which our
madness has its roots.

I tried to help. We can't stop what's happening to us. It's out of
control. Humanity is in thrall to a collective mental illness /
collective death wish / collective repetition compulsion. The
paradoxical benefit is that observing the degree to which collective
humanity is insane can prompt some of us to recover our sanity before
the collapse comes. So it's a healing opportunity.

I've done what I could. Telling a man he's "nuts" when he tries to
help with the healing process is indicative of the general state of
fear and denial.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-08-26 09:23:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Aug 25, 7:02 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
The above is NOT science; it is opinion. Your "core essentials" are
beliefs.
These are not only disputable, they are scientifically silly.  The
most scientific claim is the one concerning the limits to animal
testing.  That is provable and measureable or it is not.  It is well
known that there are differences between mammals regarding how they
respond to e.g. drugs.  There are also great similarities.  If you
test a drug on an animal and it causes no ill effects then that does
not prove it is safe for humans and that is well known.  It just
proves that it has passed that hurdle.   You assume that the people
doing the testing and using the results of testing, know nothing about
physiology, molecular biology, genetics and chemistry and just pour
stuff over rabbits and stand back.
The Velikovsky stuff is nuts.  This is a psychologist who made
fantastical claims about planets that collided with the earth by doing
psycho analysis on patients.  The fact that it disagrees with all of
geology, physics and biology, is calmly ignored.
The mother and infant stuff is fanciful, unprovable and basically
invented.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
(1) No amount of detailed theoretical knowledge about physiology can
overcome the real "core essential" that so-called animal tests have
ZERO predictive value for the effect a substance has on humans.
That is simply not true.
It is not just theoretical knowledge, valuable and all as that is.
Do you really imagine that people who work on mammalian physiology
could not find this out directly by experiment?
You can find out the effects on humans of all manner of substances by
applying them to humans. This is done in clinical trials every day
for all new drugs before they are released. It is also done in
physiology labs all over the world in order to investigate normal
human physiology. You can also do the same on animal models. You can
then measure dirtectly what is the same and what is different. When
you do that you see that some things are the same and some are
different and this is well understood.
Post by Special Care
When
similarities are seen, that is not predictable until the substance is
tested on humans. The 'industrial boom' after world war two depended
for its profitability upon the marketing of millions of synthetic
poisons. The false 'animal tests' provided a smokescreen enabling us
to keep the truth at a distance - the truth that this unstoppable
avalanche of poisons represents a collective death wish.
Animal testing is just one way to test toxicity. As I said, if a
substance turns out to be safe in animal tests it does not prove it is
safe for humans. You have erected a straw man.
Post by Special Care
(2) The geological record, especially in Alaska and Siberia (showing
that the scale of the destruction about eleven thousand years ago, and
later around 3,400 years ago, was clearly global in its impact, with
herds of tropical zone animals frozen within an hour, with tropical
grasses still in their mouths) - indicates a sudden change in the
earth's polar axis, and this in turn could have been brought about
only by the presence of a large 'rogue planet' very close to earth.
The supporting evidence is endless.
Velikovsky was a shrink. He sold books and made a load of money.
Your stream of "logic" above makes several leaps of faith. You used
the word "indicates"; geologists would dispute what you say anyway and
"indicates" means very little. That can mean anything you like, You
then say "could have" in a similar way. Sorry pal, given a choice
between you, the shrink and the entire community of geologists and
physicists, I do not buy it. You have a shrink and some floods; that
does not make planets shoot past at close range.
Post by Special Care
(3) I put myself in a strong debating position when I said I have
recovered (and partly never lost) the memories of the authentic
perceptions and impusles of the universal human infant. That enables
me to say to others: you don't remember your infancy, whereas I do, so
you have no right to make pronouncements about matters of which you
have no memory.
You think you do; I do not believe you. Sorry!
Post by Special Care
The way to resolve that debate would be for everybody
to perform the Practical Reparenting exercises so as to recover the
memories of the authentic perceptions and impulses of human babies.
Such a venture would necessitate safeguards in the form of an
emotional safety net, a new type of intimate communal love and caring,
because the recovery of those memories of infancy may release powerful
suppressed emotions which our civilisation does not even acknowledge
to exist in this tragic era. In that way the journey and the
destination will fuse into one when we go down that road of recovering
the memories of infancy. It was not for nothing that Apollonius-Jesus
advised us to "become as little children," little meaning infants, in
the sense of recovering the pristine, primal love and sanity of the
universal infant.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
The world is becoming a more frightening place by the day. There does
seem to be a timetable to restore full-scale dictatorship worldwide
within a few years from now. This is part of our collective amnesia /
collective repetition compulsion, meaning our pathological urge to
recreate and relive the forgotten survivalist emergencies in which our
madness has its roots.
I tried to help. We can't stop what's happening to us. It's out of
control. Humanity is in thrall to a collective mental illness /
collective death wish / collective repetition compulsion. The
paradoxical benefit is that observing the degree to which collective
humanity is insane can prompt some of us to recover our sanity before
the collapse comes. So it's a healing opportunity.
I've done what I could. Telling a man he's "nuts" when he tries to
help with the healing process is indicative of the general state of
fear and denial.
There is a much simpler explanation.
Maybe you are nuts.
Special Care
2009-08-26 16:33:34 UTC
Permalink
================
I'm not a great fan of this guy, Christopher Rudy, but was struck by
the words:
================
"Obviously, if the public doesn't have the option to refuse what is
injected into our own bodies, we don't have any freedom at all."
================
....which confirms the agenda referred to in the title of this thread
[wont be long now].
================


HEALTH FREEDOM IS YOUR CHOICE:
Mandatory Vaccines? Or Universal Self Care?

Are Mandatory Vaccines a Terror Tactic to Destroy Health Freedom in
America?
Or is This an Opportunity -- a Final Call to Action -- for Universal
Self Care?

Graphically archived at www.heartcom.org/YourChoice.htm

by Christopher Rudy, Publisher
HEARTcom Network

Sometimes we have to see how bad things really are
- a pathological system injecting us with pathogens -
before we realize that we have a choice.
We can either submit to the terror
of systemic corruption (evil),
or support the virtue of
Universal Self Care.

Aug. 26, 2009

THE PUBLIC OPTION???
Obviously, if the public doesn't have the option to refuse what is
injected into our own bodies,
we don't have any freedom at all.


Facts are indeed stubborn things, and the fact is that President Obama
is virtually surrounded by powerful corporate interests of organized
greed and corruption who put their profits and power above
Constitutional freedoms. The fact is that Corporate Law puts
stockholders before the public whenever profits are at stake.


The fruit of public worth-ship of the "golden calf" (stock market)
has become self-evident with the bailout of the banksters,
by the banksters and for the privatized corporate banksters.


The final test of our core Constitutional freedoms is now in our face
with the FINAL SOLUTION of those parasitic predatory corporate disease
profiteers who prefer to make a killing, literally, than lose power
over their pathological disease care system that they call "health
care".

Like the "preemptive warfare" policy of the military-industrial
complex that has gone on the offensive with the Big Lie of "DEFENSE"
for endless war profiteering, we're now seeing the same Big Lie of the
medical-industrial complex that is preparing to cull the population
with mass DISEASE in the name of "health care".

If you've been paying attention, you are well aware that there is a
new terror initiative at work to overshadow your personal option for
ownership and control of your own body.


Video News: Quarantine or $1000 a day fine for refusing the vaccine
http://www.FreedomsPhoenix.com/Find-Freedom.htm?At=0068112&From=News
8/23/09 • Youtube
It should be pretty obvious by now who the REAL terrorists are.


This is the final solution -- another terror tactic -- of a sick,
corrupt system of corporatism that has been usurping core
Constitutional freedoms for almost 100 years. This is also our final
opportunity to demand free, sustainable Universal Self Care.

The infamous robber barons didn't go out of business. They just went
behind the scenes like the wizard of OZ. And if the public doesn't
pull back the curtain now, unveiling the power elite potentates behind
genocidal public policies, we'll never get back to "Kansas" (our
health, our freedoms and the Republic for which it stands).


Either we have a choice to refuse toxic vaccinations
laced with genetic poisons and viral components
or you will soon see no choice nor health freedom
nor any semblance of core freedoms as we've had.

If the Obama administration stops this vaccination insanity now,
you know for sure that they are the good guys.

PRAY THAT'S THE CASE...
or we'll be preyed upon by
wolves in sheep's clothing.


Obviously, if the public doesn't have the option to refuse what is
injected into our own bodies, we don't have any freedom at all.


That leaves Americans with some hard choices.


You could network the vision of free Universal Self Care, and pray the
idea catches on, or you could succumb to the psychology of
subservience to tyranny that gets along by going along with a whack on
your immune system, allowing the Feds to vaccinate you with God-knows-
what in the vaccines. All we know for sure is that NO research has
shown the public these vaccinations are safe. We also know that the
vaccine manufacturer's have sponsored (packaged) legislation that now
grants those manufactures immunity from prosecution for a mass culling
of the population, beginning with pregnant women, children and the
elderly -- the most vulnerable among us.


The greatest evil is here masking as the greatest good.
Domestic terror is now threatening us as never before.
Concentration camps have been created to quarantine
those who refuse to accept poison-laced vaccines.


If you had a good kinesiologist muscle test your body with YOUR CHOICE
-- vaccine or no vaccine -- guess which one would test stronger?


“Conscience is the most sacred of all property."
~ James Madison, Chief Architect of the Constitution,
4th U.S. President

Pure intention for the highest and best for you and for global health
is a form of prayer.
By contrast, fear goes to the dark side that brings our worst fears
upon us.

Fact is, we are either busy being born as a living prayer
with an upward spiral of self-elevation (salvation),
or we're busy dying in a downward spiral
with fears creating fear that ignores
the higher power of in the
whole-holy spirit of
pro-active
LOVE.

IT'S YOUR CHOICE!


We're either busy being born with an upward spiral of "self-
elevation" (salvation), or we're busy dying in a downward spiral of
self-destruction.


The urgent evolution of business in support of Universal Self Care
is, at heart, the business of evolution in our new, all-connected
instant-everywhere-interactive global village.


If you do not have pure intention to pay attention to this core issue
of health freedom, then by default, you are part of the problem rather
than part of the solution. But if you DO have pure intention for free
Universal Self Care, for freedom's sake, please network this vision
far and wide.


Someone has to do it:)

~ Christopher

PS: As the old paradigm of corrupt conscience disintegrates,
institutionalized power without principle can no longer sustain the
creation and profiting from war and disease. Be prepared for major
civil disruption in the months ahead. One critical way to prepare is
food reserves. Consider the offer from Denis Korn for 5% off on the
best deal for high quality food reserves at www.PrepareDirect.com for
the month of August. Just use the coupon code number 909 at
checkout. Let me know if you order any 1-4 year food package and I'll
send you a free solar-powered, hand-crank radio that is manufactured
by the only company endorsed by the American Red Cross.

If the public doesn't rise and shine with our highest and best, we may
see the our worst fears come upon us.

Practical spirituality prays for the best yet prepares for come what
may.
Mankind has free will so anything is possible.
~CR

~~~~~~~~~

BOTTOM LINE:

Prayer by a Devotee of LOVE

Let us all pray for greater LOVE of, by and for
We The People...

May I be an instrument in thy hands, Great LOVE,
for building of the kingdom consciousness
- the outpicturing of Thy consciousness -
on Earth as it is in heavenly realms
where our evolutionary ascent
with the dimensional shift
is taking us to a space
and to a conscious
place whereby
the power
of LOVE
rules.

~~~~~~~~~

MUST READ: "Those Who Have Seen The Future"

MUST VIEW: REALITY THERAPY for 'We The People'
Part One:

Part Two:

Special Care
2009-08-26 17:08:43 UTC
Permalink
It's difficult to view all the video clips that are flying around, but
this guy, Adrian Salbuchi is interesting and articulate, though I
would say he and his kind are too little too late. I'd love to be
proved wrong, but when even Hans Ruesch remained silent in 1990, I saw
that as the end of the line, our final surrender to the ruling group,
so that already in 1990 it was *all over bar the dying* .
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
The view from Argentina on the NWO:
http://youtu.be/2iPPfOKyayg

---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------
ALL OVER BAR THE DYING?
THE LOST OPPORTUNITY OF 1990:
http://www.nzavs.org.nz/mobilise/27/12.html
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------
Seth
2009-09-18 01:59:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
(1) No amount of detailed theoretical knowledge about physiology can
overcome the real "core essential" that so-called animal tests have
ZERO predictive value for the effect a substance has on humans.
You can call it a "core essential" all you like.

I'm going to look at the statistical tests that have been done, and
determine that there is a lot of predictive value.
Post by Special Care
When similarities are seen, that is not predictable until the
substance is tested on humans.
Anything is predictable at any time. The question is, how useful is
that prediction?

Seth
Special Care
2009-09-21 16:37:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Seth
Post by Special Care
(1) No amount of detailed theoretical knowledge about physiology can
overcome the real "core essential" that so-called animal tests have
ZERO predictive value for the effect a substance has on humans.
You can call it a "core essential" all you like.
I'm going to look at the statistical tests that have been done, and
determine that there is a lot of predictive value.
Post by Special Care
When similarities are seen, that is not predictable until the
substance is tested on humans.
Anything is predictable at any time.  The question is, how useful is
that prediction?
Seth
==============================================
If you just read pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda" / "Slaughter of
the Innocent" by Hans Ruesch, with a modicum of linear syllogistic
logic and a capacity for joined-up thought, meaning seeing the whole
picture rather then isolated compartments sequentially, then you would
be able to see that any similarities between how a substance affects
one or other animal species and how it affects human beings, was never
predicted in the slightest by animal tests and became known only when
the said substances were tested on humans.

[If there was some chance of getting through to people thirty years
ago with this message, the possibility has receded, for the very
reason that our brains are filling up more and more with "animal
tested" (=untested) poisons with each passing day, dumbing us down and
draining out of us the little bit of courage we seemed to possess
thirty years ago.]

The industrial boom that followed World War Two depended for its
profitability upon the flooding of the environment with millions of
synthetic poisons that were going to destroy our health and ultimately
render planet Earth lifeless.

The false animal tests played the role of enabling us all to pretend
that the poisons that are increasingly wrecking our health and slowly
killing the biosphere had been "safety tested."

But if we are being poisoned more and more as time passes, and nobody
disputes the fact that we are being poisoned more and more as time
passes - then where do the "safety tests" come in?

The only possible answer to that is that there never were any "safety
tests" but that the false "animal tests" were our way of pretending we
are not committing slow-motion collective suicide / self-genocide /
biocide.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

REPRODUCED FROM ARCHIVE:
Pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda" / "Slaughter of the Innocent" by
Hans Ruesch:

=======

"Actually it is unfair to single out just a few dangerous
drugs, since there are thousands of them.

Of course the fallacy works both ways, precluding the acceptance of
useful drugs.

There is the great example of penicillin - if we want to consider
this
a useful drug.

Its discoverers said they were fortunate. No guinea pigs were
available for the toxicity tests, so they used mice instead.

Penicillin kills guinea pigs.

But the same guinea pigs can safely eat strychnine,
one of the deadliest poisons for humans

- but not for monkeys.

Certain wild berries are deadly for human beings,

but birds thrive on them.

A dose of belladona that would kill a man
is harmless for rabbits and goats.

Calomelan doesn't influence the secretion of bile in dogs,
but can treble it in man.

The use of digitalis - the main remedy for cardiac patients and the
saviour of countless lives the world over -
was retarded for a long time because it was fiRst tested on dogs,
in which it dangerously raises blood pressure.

And chloroform is so toxic to dogs that for many years this valuable
anesthetic was not employed on patients.

On the other hand a dose of opium that would kill a man
is harmless to dogs and chickens.

Datura and henbane are poison for man,
but food for the snail.

The mushroom *amanita phalloides*, a small dose of which can wipe out
a whole human family,
is consumed without ill effects by the rabbit, one of the most common
laboratory animals.

A porcupine can eat in one lump without discomfort as much opium as a
human addict smokes in two weeks, and wash it down with enough
prussic
acid to poison a regiment of soldiers.

The sheep can swallow enormous quantities of arsenic,
once the murderers' favourite poison.

Potassium cyanide, deadly for us,
is harmless for the owl,

but one of our common field pumpkins can put a horse into a serious
state of agitation.

Morphine, which calms and anesthetizes man,
causes maniacal excitement in cats and mice,
but dogs can stand doses up to 20 times higher than man.

On the other hand, our sweet almonds can kill foxes and chickens,

and our common parsley is poison to parrots...........

There are enough such instances to fill a book - all proving that it
would be difficult to find a more absurd and less scientific method
of
medical research (than animal experimentation).

Moreover, the anguish and sufferings of the animals, deprived of
their
natural habitat or habitual surroundings, terrorized by what they see
in the laboratories and the brutalities they are subjected to, alter
their mental balance and organic reactions to such an extent that ANY
result is a priori valueless.

The laboratory animal is a monster, made so by the experimenters.
Physically and mentally it has very little in common with a normal
animal, and much less with man.

As even Claude Bernard (1813-1878), founder of the modern
vivisectionist method, wrote in his Physiologie Operatoire (page
152):
"The experimental animal is never in a normal state. The normal state
is merely a supposition, an assumption."
......................
......................
Somebody launched the idea of breeding strains of bacteriologically
sterile laboratory animals...................

One delusion spawned another. Consistent failure made certain of
those
misguided scientists realize - some haven't realized it yet - that
organic "material" raised under such abnormal conditions differs more
than ever from normal organisms.
Animals so raised never develop the natural defence mechanism, the
so-
called immunological reaction, which is a salient characteristic of
every living organism. So it would be difficult to devise a less
reliable experimental material.
Besides, animals are by nature immune to most human infections -
diphtheria, thyphus, scarlet fever, German measles, smallpox,
cholera,
yellow fever, leprosy and bubonic plague - while other infections,
such as TB and various septicemias, take up different forms in
animals. So the claim that through animals we can learn to control
human diseases could seem a sign of madness if we didn't know that it
is just a pretext for carrying on "experiments" which, however
dangerously misleading for medical science, are either intimately
satisfying for those who execute them, or highly lucrative.

The Swiss nation illustrates well to what extent the profit motive
promotes vivisection: with a population of less than 6 million,
Switzerland uses up annually many times as many laboratory animals as
does all of Soviet Russia with its 250 million inhabitants, but where
there is no money in the making of medicines."
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-End of extract from IMPERATRICE NUDA / "Slaughter of the Innocent"
by
Hans Ruesch, pages 9-11, dated 1976.
---------------------------------------------­---------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I firmly believe that if the entire apparatus of modern medicine
could be sunk to the bottom of the sea, it would be all the better for
mankind, and all the worse for the fishes." - Oliver Wendell Holmes
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Animal Experimentation: the Hidden Cause of Environmental Pollution
http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_174g5kg85dn
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-09-21 20:53:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
Post by Seth
Post by Special Care
(1) No amount of detailed theoretical knowledge about physiology can
overcome the real "core essential" that so-called animal tests have
ZERO predictive value for the effect a substance has on humans.
You can call it a "core essential" all you like.
I'm going to look at the statistical tests that have been done, and
determine that there is a lot of predictive value.
Post by Special Care
When similarities are seen, that is not predictable until the
substance is tested on humans.
Anything is predictable at any time.  The question is, how useful is
that prediction?
Seth
==============================================
If you just read pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda" / "Slaughter of
the Innocent" by Hans Ruesch, with a modicum of linear syllogistic
logic and a capacity for joined-up thought, meaning seeing the whole
picture rather then isolated compartments sequentially,
That is a load of big words that say nothing (as usual).
You, more than anyone I have read on usenet over the past 10 years,
have an extraordinary ability to write very stylish English at great
length and to say precisely zero.
Either drug testing on animals makes some useful predictions as to
what happens in humans or it does not.
The examples you have chosen below are the exceptions that prove the
rule. I particularly liked the reference to "The Owl" and to "certain
berries". This is an impressive sounding list but can I take it then
that all other compounds behave the same in humans and laboratory
animals? When you consider the sheer number of drugs/compounds that
have been tested and the sheer number of species that you exclude from
your list, your list is tiny. It is a few vague or dubious examples
with no sources and some vague details (like the "certain berries").
Can I also take it that you do not actually know any chemistry or
biology?

There are many famous examples of differences in physiology between
humans and mice and dogs and guinea pigs etc. Many of these are well
known and due to well known and understood reasons. For example, Rats
have two genes for Insulin (we have just one) and most mammals can
make their own vitamin C while humans cannot as tey are missing an
enzyme needed to do so. Nonetheless, mammals all have roughly the
same genes and basic metabolism. Your suggestion that animals tests
have, to use your words, "zero predictive power in humans", is silly.
It is simply not true. Logic has nothing to do with it. It is not
something you just think about.

SNIP
Seth
2009-09-22 18:51:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Either drug testing on animals makes some useful predictions as to
what happens in humans or it does not.
It makes useful predictions. It is not definitive. (Then again,
testing on you isn't definitive of the results on me.)

Whether this particular substance is one where animal results are
similar to human results cannot generally be determined without human
testing; however, the chances that they are similar are typically good
enough that it's worth doing a lot of animal testing prior to human
testing. (The value is recognized primarily when the animal testing
causes the human testing to be avoided.)

Seth
Westprog
2009-09-22 20:09:51 UTC
Permalink
In article
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Either drug testing on animals makes some useful predictions as to
what happens in humans or it does not.
It makes useful predictions. It is not definitive. (Then again,
testing on you isn't definitive of the results on me.)
Whether this particular substance is one where animal results are
similar to human results cannot generally be determined without human
testing; however, the chances that they are similar are typically good
enough that it's worth doing a lot of animal testing prior to human
testing. (The value is recognized primarily when the animal testing
causes the human testing to be avoided.)
The value is often that if the animal (usually on quite high doses) gets
convulsions, birth defects or blindness, then it's a pretty good indication
that the drug should /not/ be tested on humans, but abandoned forthwith. The
drug then needs to be tested (usually in quite low doses) on humans, and
it's always possible that even on low doses it will cause convulsions, birth
defects or blindness, but at least some possible culprits have been
winnowed.
--
J/

SOTW: "Roll Away The Stone" - Mott The Hoople


Special Care
2009-09-30 09:26:37 UTC
Permalink
... (The value is recognized primarily when the animal testing
causes the human testing to be avoided.)
Seth
==========

No, the OPPOSITE of what you say is true.
You and others are just spouting the standard vivisectionist
obfuscations.
The answer is already there on pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda /
Slaughter of the Innocent."
-------------------------
"There is the great example of penicillin - if we want to consider
this a useful drug.
Its discoverers said they were fortunate. No guinea pigs were
available for the toxicity tests, so they used mice instead.
Penicillin kills guinea pigs."
------------------------
"The use of digitalis - the main remedy for cardiac patients and the
saviour of countless lives the world over -
was retarded for a long time because it was first tested on dogs,
in which it dangerously raises blood pressure.
And chloroform is so toxic to dogs that for many years this valuable
anesthetic was not employed on patients."
------------------------

So the adverse reactions of animals to substances that will - by
contrast - be useful for humans, *retard* medical science because of
your false religion, the totally discreditied vivisectionist method,
financially a goldmine but medically disastrous.

------------------------

I used to have a copy of "The SAS Survival Handbook," written by a
former soldier to teach how to survive in the wild.
The author explained how to test unfamiliar plants and fruits to see
if they were safe to eat.
He didn't mention shoving them down the throat of a bird or a
squirrel.

Perhaps he had read pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda" and he didn't
want to die.

Briefly, you just place a tiny morsel of the unfamiliar substance on
your lips and tongue.... if taste is not too vile, ingest a small
fragment, about half a gram, then wait three hours. If no adverse
reactions, ingest a bigger but still quite small fragment of the
unfamiliar substance and again wait three hours...and so on.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-09-30 10:36:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
... (The value is recognized primarily when the animal testing
causes the human testing to be avoided.)
Seth
==========
No, the OPPOSITE of what you say is true.
You and others are just spouting the standard vivisectionist
obfuscations.
The answer is already there on pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda /
Slaughter of the Innocent."
-------------------------
"There is the great example of penicillin - if we want to consider
this a useful drug.
Its discoverers said they were fortunate. No guinea pigs were
available for the toxicity tests, so they used mice instead.
Penicillin kills guinea pigs."
------------------------
"The use of digitalis - the main remedy for cardiac patients and the
saviour of countless lives the world over -
was retarded for a long time because it was first tested on dogs,
in which it dangerously raises blood pressure.
And chloroform is so toxic to dogs that for many years this valuable
anesthetic was not employed on patients."
------------------------
So the adverse reactions of animals to substances that will - by
contrast - be useful for humans, *retard* medical science because of
your false religion, the totally discreditied vivisectionist method,
financially a goldmine but medically disastrous.
------------------------
I used to have a copy of "The SAS Survival Handbook," written by a
former soldier to teach how to survive in the wild.
The author explained how to test unfamiliar plants and fruits to see
if they were safe to eat.
He didn't mention shoving them down the throat of a bird or a
squirrel.
So picture the scene; you have this SAS geezer living in a swamp for 3
weeks. His last rations have run out and he needs to get food. So
what does he do? He searches for a convenient laboratory model for
food testing and catches a selection of small mammals, birds and
fish. This takes him 3 days and he is getting really really hungry.
He erects a set of small cages to keep the animals captive while he
does the testing. This takes him a further 2 days and he is getting
seriously weak. He then administers doses of potential foodplants to
the captive animals and waits for reactions. Next day he gets rescued
and he swears that in future he will avoid the animal tests because
they were a waste of time? He also in the meantime reads a copy of
some shite that was recommended to him from a usenet newsgroup and he
swears in future to convince all SAS members to only use non-animal
tests for food toxicity questions. Is this what you had in mind???

There is a minor flaw in this scenario. If he was in a position to
catch a bird or squirrel to test on, in the first place, he could have
eaten them.
Post by Special Care
Perhaps he had read pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda" and he didn't
want to die.
Briefly, you just place a tiny morsel of the unfamiliar substance on
your lips and tongue.... if taste is not too vile, ingest a small
fragment, about half a gram, then wait three hours. If no adverse
reactions, ingest a bigger but still quite small fragment of the
unfamiliar substance and again wait three hours...and so on.
Special Care
2009-09-30 16:01:57 UTC
Permalink
On Sep 30, 11:36 am, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
... (The value is recognized primarily when the animal testing
causes the human testing to be avoided.)
Seth
==========
No, the OPPOSITE of what you say is true.
You and others are just spouting the standard vivisectionist
obfuscations.
The answer is already there on pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda /
Slaughter of the Innocent."
-------------------------
"There is the great example of penicillin - if we want to consider
this a useful drug.
Its discoverers said they were fortunate. No guinea pigs were
available for the toxicity tests, so they used mice instead.
Penicillin kills guinea pigs."
------------------------
"The use of digitalis - the main remedy for cardiac patients and the
saviour of countless lives the world over -
was retarded for a long time because it was first tested on dogs,
in which it dangerously raises blood pressure.
And chloroform is so toxic to dogs that for many years this valuable
anesthetic was not employed on patients."
------------------------
So the adverse reactions of animals to substances that will - by
contrast - be useful for humans, *retard* medical science because of
your false religion, the totally discreditied vivisectionist method,
financially a goldmine but medically disastrous.
------------------------
I used to have a copy of "The SAS Survival Handbook," written by a
former soldier to teach how to survive in the wild.
The author explained how to test unfamiliar plants and fruits to see
if they were safe to eat.
He didn't mention shoving them down the throat of a bird or a
squirrel.
So picture the scene; you have this SAS geezer living in a swamp for 3
weeks.  His last rations have run out and he needs to get food.  So
what does he do?   He searches for a convenient laboratory model for
food testing and catches a selection of small mammals, birds and
fish.  This takes him 3 days and he is getting really really hungry.
He erects a set of small cages to keep the animals captive while he
does the testing.  This takes him a further 2 days and he is getting
seriously weak.  He then administers doses of potential foodplants to
the captive animals and waits for reactions.  Next day he gets rescued
and he swears that in future he will avoid the animal tests because
they were a waste of time?   He also in the meantime reads a copy of
some shite that was recommended to him from a usenet newsgroup and he
swears in future to convince all SAS members to only use non-animal
tests for food toxicity questions.  Is this what you had in mind???
There is a minor flaw in this scenario. If he was in a position to
catch a bird or squirrel to test on, in the first place, he could have
eaten them.
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Very amusing.
But the SAS Survivors Handbook was also aimed at scenarios where a
person might be marooned in an isolated place for many months or even
years, for example after a plane crash or shipwreck far from centres
of population.

In such cases a long-term survival strategy involving identifying
edible vegetation would be needed.
If such a castaway were to catch slow moving animals or birds and
"test" a plant or root or fruit on them by force feeding...
well he might have a lucky escape with the first few such "tests," but
long term that's a good way to commit suicide.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-09-30 16:06:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Sep 30, 11:36 am, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
... (The value is recognized primarily when the animal testing
causes the human testing to be avoided.)
Seth
==========
No, the OPPOSITE of what you say is true.
You and others are just spouting the standard vivisectionist
obfuscations.
The answer is already there on pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda /
Slaughter of the Innocent."
-------------------------
"There is the great example of penicillin - if we want to consider
this a useful drug.
Its discoverers said they were fortunate. No guinea pigs were
available for the toxicity tests, so they used mice instead.
Penicillin kills guinea pigs."
------------------------
"The use of digitalis - the main remedy for cardiac patients and the
saviour of countless lives the world over -
was retarded for a long time because it was first tested on dogs,
in which it dangerously raises blood pressure.
And chloroform is so toxic to dogs that for many years this valuable
anesthetic was not employed on patients."
------------------------
So the adverse reactions of animals to substances that will - by
contrast - be useful for humans, *retard* medical science because of
your false religion, the totally discreditied vivisectionist method,
financially a goldmine but medically disastrous.
------------------------
I used to have a copy of "The SAS Survival Handbook," written by a
former soldier to teach how to survive in the wild.
The author explained how to test unfamiliar plants and fruits to see
if they were safe to eat.
He didn't mention shoving them down the throat of a bird or a
squirrel.
So picture the scene; you have this SAS geezer living in a swamp for 3
weeks.  His last rations have run out and he needs to get food.  So
what does he do?   He searches for a convenient laboratory model for
food testing and catches a selection of small mammals, birds and
fish.  This takes him 3 days and he is getting really really hungry.
He erects a set of small cages to keep the animals captive while he
does the testing.  This takes him a further 2 days and he is getting
seriously weak.  He then administers doses of potential foodplants to
the captive animals and waits for reactions.  Next day he gets rescued
and he swears that in future he will avoid the animal tests because
they were a waste of time?   He also in the meantime reads a copy of
some shite that was recommended to him from a usenet newsgroup and he
swears in future to convince all SAS members to only use non-animal
tests for food toxicity questions.  Is this what you had in mind???
There is a minor flaw in this scenario. If he was in a position to
catch a bird or squirrel to test on, in the first place, he could have
eaten them.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Very amusing.
But the SAS Survivors Handbook was also aimed at scenarios where a
person might be marooned in an isolated place for many months or even
years, for example after a plane crash or shipwreck far from centres
of population.
In such cases a long-term survival strategy involving identifying
edible vegetation would be needed.
If such a castaway were to catch slow moving animals or birds and
"test" a plant or root or fruit on them by force feeding...
well he might have a lucky escape with the first few such "tests," but
long term that's a good way to commit suicide.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-09-30 16:21:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Sep 30, 11:36 am, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
... (The value is recognized primarily when the animal testing
causes the human testing to be avoided.)
Seth
==========
No, the OPPOSITE of what you say is true.
You and others are just spouting the standard vivisectionist
obfuscations.
The answer is already there on pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda /
Slaughter of the Innocent."
-------------------------
"There is the great example of penicillin - if we want to consider
this a useful drug.
Its discoverers said they were fortunate. No guinea pigs were
available for the toxicity tests, so they used mice instead.
Penicillin kills guinea pigs."
------------------------
"The use of digitalis - the main remedy for cardiac patients and the
saviour of countless lives the world over -
was retarded for a long time because it was first tested on dogs,
in which it dangerously raises blood pressure.
And chloroform is so toxic to dogs that for many years this valuable
anesthetic was not employed on patients."
------------------------
So the adverse reactions of animals to substances that will - by
contrast - be useful for humans, *retard* medical science because of
your false religion, the totally discreditied vivisectionist method,
financially a goldmine but medically disastrous.
------------------------
I used to have a copy of "The SAS Survival Handbook," written by a
former soldier to teach how to survive in the wild.
The author explained how to test unfamiliar plants and fruits to see
if they were safe to eat.
He didn't mention shoving them down the throat of a bird or a
squirrel.
So picture the scene; you have this SAS geezer living in a swamp for 3
weeks.  His last rations have run out and he needs to get food.  So
what does he do?   He searches for a convenient laboratory model for
food testing and catches a selection of small mammals, birds and
fish.  This takes him 3 days and he is getting really really hungry.
He erects a set of small cages to keep the animals captive while he
does the testing.  This takes him a further 2 days and he is getting
seriously weak.  He then administers doses of potential foodplants to
the captive animals and waits for reactions.  Next day he gets rescued
and he swears that in future he will avoid the animal tests because
they were a waste of time?   He also in the meantime reads a copy of
some shite that was recommended to him from a usenet newsgroup and he
swears in future to convince all SAS members to only use non-animal
tests for food toxicity questions.  Is this what you had in mind???
There is a minor flaw in this scenario. If he was in a position to
catch a bird or squirrel to test on, in the first place, he could have
eaten them.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Very amusing.
But the SAS Survivors Handbook was also aimed at scenarios where a
person might be marooned in an isolated place for many months or even
years, for example after a plane crash or shipwreck far from centres
of population.
In such cases a long-term survival strategy involving identifying
edible vegetation would be needed.
If such a castaway were to catch slow moving animals or birds and
"test" a plant or root or fruit on them by force feeding...
well he might have a lucky escape with the first few such "tests," but
long term that's a good way to commit suicide.
My scenario was preposterous in order to help you see just how crazy
your suggestion was that you even considered the possibility of a
soldier deciding whether or not to carry out a series of animal tests
in order to see if something was safe or not and using the SAS
handbook as a justification for not doing animal testing.

You know what the ironic thing is? When people were faced with this
dilemma for real (i.e. not in your imagination or on some blog), the
traditional way of testing new food is indeed to test it on animals.
Traditionally the food was given to dogs or pigs. If they refused to
eat it and or got sick, you did not look further. If they eat it with
no bad effects, you try a small amount on humans. Your testing regime
is useless. Have you really gone and tried this? Go to the woods.
If you try
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amanita_phalloides you will need a liver
transplant if you are lucky. They taste great! They are delicious
and have no nasty initial effects for the first few hours. It takes a
tiny amount.
Here is a higher plant that is also delicious. Cattle (and humans)
can safely eat the leaves. The roots and stems are poisonous (and
tasty). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_dropwort
Special Care
2009-09-30 16:50:08 UTC
Permalink
On Sep 30, 5:21 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Very amusing.
But the SAS Survivors Handbook was also aimed at scenarios where a
person might be marooned in an isolated place for many months or even
years, for example after a plane crash or shipwreck far from centres
of population.
In such cases a long-term survival strategy involving identifying
edible vegetation would be needed.
If such a castaway were to catch slow moving animals or birds and
"test" a plant or root or fruit on them by force feeding...
well he might have a lucky escape with the first few such "tests," but
long term that's a good way to commit suicide.
My scenario was preposterous in order to help you see just how crazy
your suggestion was that you even considered the possibility of a
soldier deciding whether or not to carry out a series of animal tests
in order to see if something was safe or not and using the SAS
handbook as a justification for not doing animal testing.
You know what the ironic thing is?  When people were faced with this
dilemma for real (i.e. not in your imagination or on some blog), the
traditional way of testing new food is indeed to test it on animals.
Traditionally the food was given to dogs or pigs.  If they refused to
eat it and or got sick, you did not look further.  If they eat it with
no bad effects, you try a small amount on humans.  Your testing regime
is useless.  Have you really gone and tried this?  Go to the woods.
If you tryhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amanita_phalloidesyou will need a liver
transplant if you are lucky.  They taste great!  They are delicious
and have no nasty initial effects for the first few hours.  It takes a
tiny amount.
Here is a higher plant that is also delicious.  Cattle (and humans)
can safely eat the leaves.  The roots and stems are poisonous (and
tasty).  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_dropwort- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There is not much logic and no useful substance to the way you
respond.

Hans Ruesch mentioned that mushroom in pages 9 to 11 of 'Imperatrice
Nuda.'
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The mushroom *amanita phalloides*, a small dose of which can
wipe out a whole human family, is consumed without ill effects
by the rabbit, one of the most common laboratory animals."
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A circle is not a square.
Black is not white.
Animal tests can only lead to chaos.
Old Jinglebollocks
2009-09-30 20:13:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
Hans Ruesch mentioned that mushroom in pages 9 to 11 of 'Imperatrice
Nuda.'
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------
"The mushroom *amanita phalloides*, a small dose of which can
wipe out a whole human family, is consumed without ill effects
by the rabbit, one of the most common laboratory animals."
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------
A circle is not a square.
Black is not white.
Animal tests can only lead to chaos.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

LOOK AT THE TOTAL CHAOS IN THE WORLD AROUND YOU.

THE VIVISECTION SWINDLE AND THE
FAKE "ANIMAL TESTS" [=NON-TESTS]
ARE A LARGE PART OF THE CAUSE OF ALL THE IMBECILITY AND VIOLENCE YOU
SEE AROUND YOU.
WHAT DO YOU EXPECT, AS EVERYBODY'S BRAIN FILLS UP MORE AND MORE WITH
"ANIMAL TESTED" [=UNTESTED] POISONS.

MANY OF US ARE NOW AFRAID TO WALK ALONG THE STREET FOR FEAR OF BEING
KICKED TO DEATH FOR NO REASON.

WHY?

THE EVER-INCREASING BUILD UP OF "ANIMAL TESTED" [=UNTESTED] POISONS IN
YOUNG PEOPLE'S BRAINS IS DRIVING THEM ALL MORE AND MORE INSANE BY THE
DAY.

MORE NEXT WEEK, IDIOTS.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-09-30 22:26:00 UTC
Permalink
On Sep 30, 9:13 pm, Old Jinglebollocks
Post by Special Care
Hans Ruesch mentioned that mushroom in pages 9 to 11 of 'Imperatrice
Nuda.'
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­----------------
"The mushroom *amanita phalloides*, a small dose of which can
wipe out a whole human family, is consumed without ill effects
by the rabbit, one of the most common laboratory animals."
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­----------------
A circle is not a square.
Black is not white.
Animal tests can only lead to chaos.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-------------------
LOOK AT THE TOTAL CHAOS IN THE WORLD AROUND YOU.
THE VIVISECTION SWINDLE AND THE
FAKE "ANIMAL TESTS" [=NON-TESTS]
ARE A LARGE PART OF THE CAUSE OF ALL THE IMBECILITY AND VIOLENCE YOU
SEE AROUND YOU.
WHAT DO YOU EXPECT, AS EVERYBODY'S BRAIN FILLS UP MORE AND MORE WITH
"ANIMAL TESTED" [=UNTESTED] POISONS.
MANY OF US ARE NOW AFRAID TO WALK ALONG THE STREET FOR FEAR OF BEING
KICKED TO DEATH FOR NO REASON.
WHY?
THE EVER-INCREASING BUILD UP OF "ANIMAL TESTED" [=UNTESTED] POISONS IN
YOUNG PEOPLE'S BRAINS IS DRIVING THEM ALL MORE AND MORE INSANE BY THE
DAY.
MORE NEXT WEEK, IDIOTS.
Now you are shouting and you are calling people "IDIOTS". This is
really guaranteed to make folks sit up and pay attention .... yawn
Special Care
2009-10-01 17:38:29 UTC
Permalink
On Sep 30, 11:26 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Now you are shouting and you are calling people "IDIOTS".  This is
really guaranteed to make folks sit up and pay attention .... yawn
------------------------------------------------------------

But it's not about "making" people pay attention.

Far in the future, when people get weary of the long sorrow, they will
embrace healing.

But it's not going to happen in the present era, because we're "too
far gone."

That is largely the reason I got drunk a few times and posted
"informally" a few months ago, and I never deleted those "informal"
posts from the Google system, because they are very meaningful to
anyone who has his head screwed on. We are living in an insane
civilisation, a mentally ill civilisation. I was conveying the point
that if you all insist on clinging so tenaciously to your collective
mental illness, well then I refuse to make any pretence of "dignity"
in your global lunatic asylum.

One thing I would say is that there is a strong healing current
entering the world today, and seeking human channels.
Your "scientific" colleagues will tell you that to every action there
is a reaction.
After eleven thousand years of collective mental illness, there is now
a healing current striving to enter the world as a reaction against
that eleven thousand years of inertia and indifference.

I was open to that reaction / healing current in 2003, and I gladly
embraced it and started writing accordingly to promote healing.

We are so far "off the rails" that the healing current in this era
will be only a forlorn gesture. The poisoning process will continue,
and a third world war will soon be instigated, with the aim of a new
"treaty" involving full-scale dictatorship worldwide.

Only "Ishtar" [now fashionably called "Planet X"] can save us from
that.

This is all part of the collective mental illness, a pathological
compulsion to recreate and relive the ancient survivalist emergencies
and full-scale dictatorship of long ago that became associated in our
brains and archetypes with physical survival.

I don't "fight" it, as such, because I know we can't win in this
present era...... but there is still a current of healing which impels
some of us to continue to type the truth in a public place.

In the end we come back to the words of Paddy P -
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"We seem to have lost.
We have not lost.
To refuse to fight would have been to lose.
To fight is to win.
We have kept faith with the past
and handed a tradition to the future.
If our deed has not been sufficient to win freedom,
then our children shall win it with a better deed."
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Paddy P's words are just right - stated here to refer to non-violent
applications of healing programmes]
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-09-30 22:24:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Sep 30, 5:21 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Very amusing.
But the SAS Survivors Handbook was also aimed at scenarios where a
person might be marooned in an isolated place for many months or even
years, for example after a plane crash or shipwreck far from centres
of population.
In such cases a long-term survival strategy involving identifying
edible vegetation would be needed.
If such a castaway were to catch slow moving animals or birds and
"test" a plant or root or fruit on them by force feeding...
well he might have a lucky escape with the first few such "tests," but
long term that's a good way to commit suicide.
My scenario was preposterous in order to help you see just how crazy
your suggestion was that you even considered the possibility of a
soldier deciding whether or not to carry out a series of animal tests
in order to see if something was safe or not and using the SAS
handbook as a justification for not doing animal testing.
You know what the ironic thing is?  When people were faced with this
dilemma for real (i.e. not in your imagination or on some blog), the
traditional way of testing new food is indeed to test it on animals.
Traditionally the food was given to dogs or pigs.  If they refused to
eat it and or got sick, you did not look further.  If they eat it with
no bad effects, you try a small amount on humans.  Your testing regime
is useless.  Have you really gone and tried this?  Go to the woods.
If you tryhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amanita_phalloidesyouwill need a liver
transplant if you are lucky.  They taste great!  They are delicious
and have no nasty initial effects for the first few hours.  It takes a
tiny amount.
Here is a higher plant that is also delicious.  Cattle (and humans)
can safely eat the leaves.  The roots and stems are poisonous (and
tasty).  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_dropwort-Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------
There is not much logic and no useful substance to the way you
respond.
Hans Ruesch mentioned that mushroom in pages 9 to 11 of 'Imperatrice
Nuda.'
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------
"The mushroom *amanita phalloides*, a small dose of which can
wipe out a whole human family, is consumed without ill effects
by the rabbit, one of the most common laboratory animals."
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------
Logic and substance?
The argument was about your silly example of an SAS handbook.

Intravenous alpha amanitin, the toxic ingredient, kills rabbits just
like all other mammals and for the same reasons. Orally, it also
kills most mammals. I cannot find any original source for your
statement above apart from animal rights sites which quote this as if
it is gospel; they all gor that from the same source as you; a book
that you swallowed hook line and sinker and which you believe as a
mater of faith.

You gave a method for testing that did not inbvolve animals. I gave 2
examples which would kill you if you did that. You gave one example
which would kill you if you used a rabbit but I question whether that
is true and even if it was, you are better off eating the rabbit and
testng the mushroom on the dog.
Post by Special Care
A circle is not a square.
Black is not white.
Animal tests can only lead to chaos.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Seth
2009-10-02 02:26:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
... (The value is recognized primarily when the animal testing
causes the human testing to be avoided.)
No, the OPPOSITE of what you say is true.
So you believe there's no value in avoiding human testing? Have you
volunteered for the next test, since you don't think it should be
avoided?
Post by Special Care
You and others are just spouting the standard vivisectionist
obfuscations.
They're called "facts" in this universe.
Post by Special Care
The answer is already there on pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda /
Slaughter of the Innocent."
Which was refereed by whom? Oh, I see.
Post by Special Care
"There is the great example of penicillin - if we want to consider
this a useful drug.
Its discoverers said they were fortunate. No guinea pigs were
available for the toxicity tests, so they used mice instead.
Penicillin kills guinea pigs."
So? How many species might they have tested it on? How many would it
have helped? Something that has a 90% chance of getting the right
answer, without killing any people when it fails, is a good thing.
Post by Special Care
"The use of digitalis - the main remedy for cardiac patients and the
saviour of countless lives the world over -
was retarded for a long time because it was first tested on dogs,
in which it dangerously raises blood pressure.
And chloroform is so toxic to dogs that for many years this valuable
anesthetic was not employed on patients."
So sometimes they get the wrong answer. That doesn't mean they
_always_ or even _usually_ do.

But you claim "no value" when all you've shown is a handful of
examples over millions of cases.
Post by Special Care
So the adverse reactions of animals to substances that will - by
contrast - be useful for humans, *retard* medical science because of
your false religion, the totally discreditied vivisectionist method,
financially a goldmine but medically disastrous.
So you claim that several examples is "will" but the hundreds or tens
of thousands of examples the other way mean what?
Post by Special Care
I used to have a copy of "The SAS Survival Handbook," written by a
former soldier to teach how to survive in the wild.
The author explained how to test unfamiliar plants and fruits to see
if they were safe to eat.
He didn't mention shoving them down the throat of a bird or a
squirrel.
Perhaps he had read pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda" and he didn't
want to die.
Or perhaps he thought that if he'd had a bird or squirrel, he'd just
eat it.
Post by Special Care
Briefly, you just place a tiny morsel of the unfamiliar substance on
your lips and tongue.... if taste is not too vile, ingest a small
fragment, about half a gram, then wait three hours.
If you're dead, you should have tested it on animals first, but it's
too late for that.

Seth
Special Care
2009-10-02 17:49:31 UTC
Permalink
<> .....
Post by Special Care
"There is the great example of penicillin - if we want to consider
this a useful drug.
Its discoverers said they were fortunate. No guinea pigs were
available for the toxicity tests, so they used mice instead.
Penicillin kills guinea pigs."
So?  How many species might they have tested it on?  How many would it
have helped?  Something that has a 90% chance of getting the right
answer, without killing any people when it fails, is a good thing.
Seth
=========================

The 90% figure is just pulled out of a hat.
A highly appropriate way of describing it, since the vivisectionist
method is the same as a stage magicians *smoke and mirrors*
tricks.....

The vivisectionists have the upper hand because they recognised the
emotionally crippled state of the mass individual in this
civilisation.
Something very bad happened to humanity about eleven thousand years
ago, as shown by the universally agreed geological record.
The Vivisection Swindle cannot be separated from that terrible event,
which drove our ancestors insane and has left humanity emotionally
crippled and delusional.

The Vivisection Swindle succeeds because human beings are terrified of
thinking for themselves, although some make a pretence of it and call
themselves "freethinkers," while cowering in fear if you mention one
of the Forbidden Subjects to them.
The need for a messiah/guru/priest/expert to do our thinking for us
originated in that major trauma of about eleven thousand years ago,
shown by the agreed geological record.

Recovery from such a terrible trauma will be slow. So for the
foreseeable future, the vivisectionists are 'away with it.'
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In the end we come back to the words of Paddy P -
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------------
"We seem to have lost.
We have not lost.
To refuse to fight would have been to lose.
To fight is to win.........
If our deed has not been sufficient to win freedom,
then our children shall win it with a better deed."
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­---------------------
[Paddy P's words are just right - stated here to refer to non-violent
applications of healing programmes]
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A Tribute to Paddy P

Seth
2009-10-17 22:18:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
The 90% figure is just pulled out of a hat.
So is everything you claim.
Post by Special Care
The vivisectionists have the upper hand because they recognised the
emotionally crippled state of the mass individual in this
civilisation.
Rather, because they can count and do statistics, unlike, say, you.
Post by Special Care
Something very bad happened to humanity about eleven thousand years
ago, as shown by the universally agreed geological record.
"Universally agreed" by whom? Name three non-nutcases.
Post by Special Care
The Vivisection Swindle cannot be separated from that terrible event,
which drove our ancestors insane and has left humanity emotionally
crippled and delusional.
Especially you and those you reference, right?

Seth
Seth
2009-09-30 02:35:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
If you just read pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda" / "Slaughter of
the Innocent" by Hans Ruesch, with a modicum of linear syllogistic
logic and a capacity for joined-up thought,
Do you know what that means?
Post by Special Care
meaning seeing the whole
picture rather then isolated compartments sequentially,
Apparently not.

I do logic. Each step must logically follow from the preceeding
steps.
Post by Special Care
then you would
be able to see that any similarities between how a substance affects
one or other animal species and how it affects human beings, was never
predicted in the slightest by animal tests and became known only when
the said substances were tested on humans.
Well, duh. You can't predict the correlation between X and Y from X.
The correlation is external to animal tests alone; rather, over many
years, animal tests and human tests have proven to be well-correlated,
so it is a reasonable conclusion that they are likely to continue to
be so.
Post by Special Care
[If there was some chance of getting through to people thirty years
ago with this message, the possibility has receded, for the very
reason that our brains are filling up more and more with "animal
tested" (=untested) poisons with each passing day, dumbing us down and
draining out of us the little bit of courage we seemed to possess
thirty years ago.]
If you want to claim that you're getting stupider, I won't argue.
Post by Special Care
The industrial boom that followed World War Two depended for its
profitability upon the flooding of the environment with millions of
synthetic poisons that were going to destroy our health and ultimately
render planet Earth lifeless.
No, it didn't. But facts aren't relevant to you "whole picture"
types.
Post by Special Care
The false animal tests
How were they false? Were they really performed on humans? Martians?
Or robots?
Post by Special Care
played the role of enabling us all to pretend
that the poisons that are increasingly wrecking our health and slowly
killing the biosphere had been "safety tested."
But you magically know better than anybody else. In case you hadn't
noticed this before, the biosphere is mostly animals.
Post by Special Care
But if we are being poisoned more and more as time passes, and nobody
disputes the fact that we are being poisoned more and more as time
passes - then where do the "safety tests" come in?
You say "if something" and then "nobody disputes that something" as if
your claims were facts and could lead to valid conclusions.
Post by Special Care
The only possible answer to that is
That your entire thesis is bogus.
Post by Special Care
that there never were any "safety tests" but that the false "animal
tests"
So, what were they?
Post by Special Care
were our way of pretending we are not committing slow-motion
collective suicide / self-genocide / biocide.
Speak for yourself.
Post by Special Care
Pages 9 to 11 of "Imperatrice Nuda" / "Slaughter of the Innocent" by
"Actually it is unfair to single out just a few dangerous
drugs, since there are thousands of them.
Millions, even. Most never made it to the market, or even to human
testing, because they failed animal testing.
Post by Special Care
There is the great example of penicillin - if we want to consider
this a useful drug.
Personally, I'm allergic to it. But it has saved the lives of many
others.
Post by Special Care
Certain wild berries are deadly for human beings,
but birds thrive on them.
Yes, there are many examples of stuff that is deadly to some species
and harmless to others. But I still say that I'll survive longer than
you if I test random wild mushrooms on dogs before eating them, and
you just randomly choose which to eat.
Post by Special Care
There are enough such instances to fill a book - all proving that it
would be difficult to find a more absurd and less scientific method
of medical research (than animal experimentation).
There are thousands of species, and tens of thousands (or millions) of
compounds that might be tested. A 99% correlation between the effects
on humans and (each species of) animals would provide lots of useful
data, and thousands of individual examples where effects differed.

Seth
--
"Those who fail to do arithmetic are doomed to talk nonsense." -- John
McCarthy, SAIL
Gordon Burditt
2009-09-21 22:41:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
(1) No amount of detailed theoretical knowledge about physiology can
overcome the real "core essential" that so-called animal tests have
A "core essential" is a religious belief, based on faith alone.
Post by Special Care
ZERO predictive value for the effect a substance has on humans. When
Incorrect. Almost all (do you know of any exceptions?) of the stuff
marketed as "rat poison" is also bad for humans to eat. That,
alone, is predictive value. It's not 100% predictive value, but
it's not zero either.

For that matter, testing on humans is not 100%, either. Peanuts can
kill. Not all humans, but some. Your sample might not be large
enough to include someone allergic.
Post by Special Care
similarities are seen, that is not predictable until the substance is
tested on humans. The 'industrial boom' after world war two depended
for its profitability upon the marketing of millions of synthetic
poisons.
Are you talking about drugs here, or environmental pollution?

It's obvious from the reference to World War II, the so-called
poisons have been tested on humans for over 60 years, even if it's
a "marketing test", and the test subjects didn't know they were
subjects of a test.

How do you know if a substance is a poison? Do you want me to test
it on YOU first?
Post by Special Care
The false 'animal tests' provided a smokescreen enabling us
to keep the truth at a distance - the truth that this unstoppable
avalanche of poisons represents a collective death wish.
There's no such thing as a "collective wish", death or any other
kind. It makes about as much sense as "collective appendicitis"
or "collective dental cavities".

Some drugs are used *because* they are toxic in some way or other,
but that can be controlled by dosage. Bo*TOX*, for example, it's
even in the name. Anesthetics, for another example.

If the avalanche of poisons was unstoppable, it wouldn't matter then
if they tested it on prisoners (humans), they'd still be marketed.
Post by Special Care
(2) The geological record, especially in Alaska and Siberia (showing
that the scale of the destruction about eleven thousand years ago, and
later around 3,400 years ago, was clearly global in its impact, with
herds of tropical zone animals frozen within an hour, with tropical
grasses still in their mouths) - indicates a sudden change in the
earth's polar axis, and this in turn could have been brought about
only by the presence of a large 'rogue planet' very close to earth.
The supporting evidence is endless.
So how come we can't freeze a mastadon (or something equivalent in
size) all the way through in an hour by immersing it in liquid
nitrogen? It's just too large and has too much heat capacity. Or
do you claim that the catastrophe liquefied the atmosphere?
Post by Special Care
(3) I put myself in a strong debating position when I said I have
recovered (and partly never lost) the memories of the authentic
perceptions and impusles of the universal human infant. That enables
Lots of people using LSD thought they had authentic memories of
all sorts of stuff. How do you know those are accurate?
Post by Special Care
me to say to others: you don't remember your infancy, whereas I do, so
you have no right to make pronouncements about matters of which you
have no memory. The way to resolve that debate would be for everybody
to perform the Practical Reparenting exercises so as to recover the
memories of the authentic perceptions and impulses of human babies.
So how do you know that these work? As distinguished from other
recovered memories that sometimes result in memories of abuse
as a child by someone who died before the child in question was born?
Post by Special Care
Such a venture would necessitate safeguards in the form of an
emotional safety net, a new type of intimate communal love and caring,
because the recovery of those memories of infancy may release powerful
suppressed emotions which our civilisation does not even acknowledge
to exist in this tragic era.
Are you sure you don't want to test these procedures on animals first?
Seth
2009-09-18 01:57:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
For an example of an indisputable core essential - you can't get past
pages 9 to 11 of "Slaughter of the Innocent / Imperatrice Nuda" by
Hans Ruesch, showing that animal tests have no predictive value for
the effect a substance has on human beings,
Except that they have quite a lot of predictive value, in the
mathematical sense of being highly correlated.

Here are a bunch of mushrooms I found. I'm going to feed part of one
to a dog, and if it survives, I'll eat the rest of it, then try
another (this might require several dogs before my hunger is
satisfied). You just go ahead and randomly choose several to eat. I
think my survival chances are much better than yours.
Post by Special Care
and that therefore fake animal tests [=non-tests] are the immediate
cause of environmental pollution,
You're leaving out a lot of steps there, like all of them.
Post by Special Care
and furthermore the forces of our profit-driven economy
guarantee that the level of pollution will keep on getting worse until
there is a global public health crisis and the fatal poisoning or
infertility of the food chain,
That's your claim, without evidence.
Post by Special Care
leading to widespread famine and disease and the collapse of
civilisation. That is clear to anyone who thinks it through.
There's a logical fallacy in that, with an impressive Latin name.
Post by Special Care
That the human species has a collective death wish
is beyond dispute.
I dispute it. Therefore, it is not beyond dispute.
Post by Special Care
Another core essential, for those who read most of what I write,
Why would anybody care what is essential for someone with that much
excess free time?

Seth
Special Care
2009-10-04 17:33:55 UTC
Permalink
On Aug 25, 2:01 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
In 1950s Ireland, polio was rife.  It is now more or less eliminated.
I have two close relatives who got it and they lived in clean suburban
semi detached houses and did not get it through bad lifestyle
choices.  Are you really suggesting that the vaccine was a hoax?  Are
you saying the vaccine has no effect?  You seem to imply that the
numbers were declining at such a rate that it would have eliminated
itself?
That graph you mention to back that up is a hand drawn graph from
another animal rights blog written by a psychologist.  Anyone can do
that just by making stuff up.  Can you find a real scientific
reference published in the real medical or scientific literature to
back up that remarkable claim?
-------------

It's not my emphasis, but the following seems real enough:

"The statistics and public health records once again refute the claims
and extensive media promotion surrounding polio vaccine. According to
the surgeon and medical historian Dr. M. Beddow Bayley (who also
photographed children in hospital who had died of vaccine poisoning
from diphtheria shots), the rate of paralytic polio in 1942 was 39 per
100,000 people, and decreased to 15 cases per 100,000 people by 1952,
prior to the introduction of the Salk vaccine.6
What effect did the Salk vaccine have on the polio epidemic? Listed
below are public health statistics (U.S. Public Health Reports) from
the four states which adopted compulsory vaccination, and the figures
from Los Angeles, California:
Tennessee:
1958: 119 cases of polio before compulsory shots
1959: 386 cases of polio after compulsory shots
Ohio:
1958: 17 cases of polio before compulsory shots
1959: 52 cases of polio after compulsory shots
Connecticut:
1958: 45 cases of polio before compulsory shots
1959: 123 cases of polio after compulsory shots
North Carolina:
1958: 78 cases of polio before compulsory shots
1959: 313 cases of polio after compulsory shots
Los Angeles:
1958: 89 cases of polio before shots
1959: 190 cases of polio after shots7"

-from "The Vaccinations Connection" by Sue Marston
---------------------

Those are official public health department figures.
If you investigate similar public health records in Ireland or
anywhere else, you should expect to find the same pattern, and that is
separate from all the other damage done to our general health by
vaccines. Remember, vaccines are by definition poisons. The very
purpose of vaccines is always to poison you and your babies. Vaccines
exist only because there is money to be made from them. There is not
much money to be made from a healthy population.

It's not my emphasis, though.
My emphasis is that there is a need to construct an analysis of the
human condition and the healing formula toward which the analysis
points, which will rely only on core essential truths which are not
disputable and which require no formal education and need no
verification by academics/experts....
The reason this is so important is the sad fact that in this type of
civilisation, academics/experts will always be condemned to oppose
innovation, progress, healing, as shown in the following report:
http://www.thunderbolts.info/thunderblogs/guest_jdd.htm
Special Care
2009-10-05 07:18:09 UTC
Permalink
The "Big Lie"
has become so BIG
and so BOLD
and so often TOLD
that people believe the lie
to their own self destruction:


The Swine Flu Conspiracy posted 09/30/2009
http://informationliberation.com/?id=27510
This YouTube video was created just a few days ago
and is the best exposure to date of the lying media
propagandists and the politicized junk science
behind autism, vaccines and the current crisis of
domestic terrorism that is now forcing all Americans
to confront the heartless and insane agenda of
giant corporate interests that profit from the
creation and management of terror and disease.

[Watch it before Google censors it, which they
are doing to other vaccination expose's.]

The "full-spectrum conscious disorder" (autism)
that afflicts many children and many adults now
will be nothing compared to the consequences
of this evil mandatory vaccination agenda that
is intended to make us all stupid as in "DUH"
(Dummies Unconscious & Heartless).

Now we are face-to-face with their "final solution".
The "quarantine" (internment) camps are prepared.
The vaccines will cause massive plague and death
that will be blamed on those refusing vaccination.
The enemies have been targeted with Homeland
Security's surveillance of those pesky patriots...
AND THOSE WHO DON'T "COOPERATE".
(See: "The Vaccine Chip Tracking System")

We are told there is NO exemption to the mandatory H1N1 swine flu
vaccination.

Realize that without the freedom to refuse this vaccine, you have no
freedom.

The laws are in place now as we are in a pandemic level "national
emergency".

This is a transparent agenda to create terror and force
totalitarian "Marital law".

If you know what's in these vaccines, you know that they are designed
to create a "self-fulfilling prophecy" of mass plague and dying that
will be blamed on those who refuse the vaccine, refuse to be
quarantined and refuse to go along with mass hysteria whereby courts
of law are now set up to fine and/or imprison the refusniks .


These are NOT constitutional laws - they are statutory laws that have
been created and foisted on the legal system by power elite interests
behind Big Pharma, Big Media, Big Oil, Big Banks and the collusion of
Big Business with Big Government that is creating an Orwellian
nightmare.

This is the "final solution" of power elite potentates who are ethical
infants.

Their time is short and their fear is great...
trying to make everyone as miserable
as they have been and now clearly are.

These are the status quo "special interests" that must CHANGE.

Options will be presented and choices will be made.

Article follows on "Vaccine Domestic Terror Overview" at:
www.heartcom.org/GlobalRealityShow.htm
Special Care
2009-10-05 08:07:39 UTC
Permalink
http://informationliberation.com/?id=27510

The signs of things to come were already there in the 1980s, staring
us all in the face, and glaringly so.

The surprise for those of us who saw this coming is only that it has
happened in slow motion.

We expected it to come to this much, much sooner.

Nothing was done then, nothing will be done now, except the same
DELIBERATELY INEFFECTIVE "protests."

This indicates a collective death wish in all human beings.

Humanity has a pathological compulsion to recreate and relive the
ancient survivalist emergencies in which our collective madness is
rooted.
Reverting to full-scale dictatorship worldwide is part of our
pathology and we all have been colluding in that process of reversion
to full-scale dictatorship by our silence or our DELIBERATELY
INEFFECTIVE "protests."

It really is the "perfect" dictatorship, because it's not being
imposed by force. The people are voting for it, as in Ireland a few
days ago... almost demanding it....
We are very sick.

It is self perpetutating, because only confronting and processing the
Forbidden Subjects can heal us, and we are too weak and cowardly to
deal with those dreaded Forbidden Subjects.
===============================================
"The octogenarian founder of psychoanalysis was not yet at the end of
his insights and revelations.
A repressed thought was asking to be spelled
out.
"If we consider mankind as a whole and substitute it for a single
individual, we discover that it too has developed delusions which are
inaccessible to logical criticism and which contradict reality. If, in
spite of this, they [the delusions] are able to exert an extraordinary
power over men, investigation leads us to the same explanation as in
the case of the single individual. They owe their power to the element
of historical truth which they have brought up from the repression of
the forgotten and primeval
past."
-Freud, "Construction in
Analysis."
Freud speaks here of mankind's delusions, therefore delusions in which
all of us take part and which are deaf to logical criticism; at the
bottom, however, is a historical truth. What, then, is this truth, the
happening that once overwhelmed the human race and traumatised and
poisoned and scorched the minds of all generations that
followed?"
-from "Mankind In Amnesia" by Immanuel Velikovsky,
1982.
==============================================
http://informationliberation.com/?id=27510
James and LuAnne Smith
2009-10-17 02:15:00 UTC
Permalink
Saddom was the last one down the line of world dictator has anyone took
over?
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-05 12:13:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
The "Big Lie"
has become so BIG
and so BOLD
and so often TOLD
that people believe the lie
The Swine Flu Conspiracy posted 09/30/2009http://informationliberation.com/?id=27510
This YouTube video was created just a few days ago
and is the best exposure to date of the lying media
propagandists and the politicized junk science
behind autism, vaccines and the current crisis of
domestic terrorism that is now forcing all Americans
to confront the heartless and insane agenda of
giant corporate interests that profit from the
creation and management of terror and disease.
[Watch it before Google censors it, which they
are doing to other vaccination expose's.]
The "full-spectrum conscious disorder" (autism)
 that afflicts many children and many adults now
 will be nothing compared to the consequences
 of this evil mandatory vaccination agenda that
 is intended to make us all stupid as in "DUH"
 (Dummies Unconscious & Heartless).
 Now we are face-to-face with their "final solution".
 The "quarantine" (internment) camps are prepared.
 The vaccines will cause massive plague and death
 that will be blamed on those refusing vaccination.
 The enemies have been targeted with Homeland
 Security's surveillance of those pesky patriots...
 AND THOSE WHO DON'T "COOPERATE".
(See: "The Vaccine Chip Tracking System")
We are told there is NO exemption to the mandatory H1N1 swine flu
vaccination.
Realize that without the freedom to refuse this vaccine, you have no
freedom.
The laws are in place now as we are in a pandemic level "national
emergency".
   This is a transparent agenda to create terror and force
totalitarian "Marital law".
If you know what's in these vaccines, you know that they are designed
to create a "self-fulfilling prophecy" of mass plague and dying that
will be blamed on those who refuse the vaccine, refuse to be
quarantined and refuse to go along with mass hysteria whereby courts
of law are now set up to fine and/or imprison the refusniks .
These are NOT constitutional laws - they are statutory laws that have
been created and foisted on the legal system by power elite interests
behind Big Pharma, Big Media, Big Oil, Big Banks and the collusion of
Big Business with Big Government that is creating an Orwellian
nightmare.
This is the "final solution" of power elite potentates who are ethical
infants.
Their time is short and their fear is great...
trying to make everyone as miserable
as they have been and now clearly are.
These are the status quo "special interests" that must CHANGE.
Options will be presented and choices will be made.
Article follows on "Vaccine Domestic Terror Overview" at:www.heartcom.org/GlobalRealityShow.htm
Why do you believe all this silly shite? The above is just a pile of
words you copied off a blog.
You refuse to believe "experts" but you are quite happy to believe any
silly old shite that any fruitcake posts on a website.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-05 12:09:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Aug 25, 2:01 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
In 1950s Ireland, polio was rife.  It is now more or less eliminated.
I have two close relatives who got it and they lived in clean suburban
semi detached houses and did not get it through bad lifestyle
choices.  Are you really suggesting that the vaccine was a hoax?  Are
you saying the vaccine has no effect?  You seem to imply that the
numbers were declining at such a rate that it would have eliminated
itself?
That graph you mention to back that up is a hand drawn graph from
another animal rights blog written by a psychologist.  Anyone can do
that just by making stuff up.  Can you find a real scientific
reference published in the real medical or scientific literature to
back up that remarkable claim?
-------------
"The statistics and public health records once again refute the claims
and extensive media promotion surrounding polio vaccine. According to
the surgeon and medical historian Dr. M. Beddow Bayley (who also
photographed children in hospital who had died of vaccine poisoning
from diphtheria shots), the rate of paralytic polio in 1942 was 39 per
100,000 people, and decreased to 15 cases per 100,000 people by 1952,
prior to the introduction of the Salk vaccine.6
What effect did the Salk vaccine have on the polio epidemic? Listed
below are public health statistics (U.S. Public Health Reports) from
the four states which adopted compulsory vaccination, and the figures
1958: 119 cases of polio before compulsory shots
1959: 386 cases of polio after compulsory shots
1958: 17 cases of polio before compulsory shots
1959: 52 cases of polio after compulsory shots
1958: 45 cases of polio before compulsory shots
1959: 123 cases of polio after compulsory shots
1958: 78 cases of polio before compulsory shots
1959: 313 cases of polio after compulsory shots
1958: 89 cases of polio before shots
1959: 190 cases of polio after shots7"
-from "The Vaccinations Connection" by Sue Marston
---------------------
Those are official public health department figures.
If you investigate similar public health records in Ireland or
anywhere else, you should expect to find the same pattern, and that is
separate from all the other damage done to our general health by
vaccines. Remember, vaccines are by definition poisons. The very
purpose of vaccines is always to poison you and your babies. Vaccines
exist only because there is money to be made from them. There is not
much money to be made from a healthy population.
It's not my emphasis, though.
My emphasis is that there is a need to construct an analysis of the
human condition and the healing formula toward which the analysis
points, which will rely only on core essential truths which are not
disputable and which require no formal education and need no
verification by academics/experts....
The reason this is so important is the sad fact that in this type of
civilisation, academics/experts will always be condemned to oppose
innovation, progress, healing, as shown in the following report:http://www.thunderbolts.info/thunderblogs/guest_jdd.htm
You know what drives me nuts about this shite? You believe all these
crackpot blogs and books written by non-"experts" with a clear
political agenda and yet you choose to ignore basic sources of
information because it comes from "experts" i.e. people who have
studied the question. The above stats are so selective as to be
basically fraudulent. The numbers are carefully hand picked and with
pseudo scientific attributions, to imply that the vaccines increased
polio rates. These numbers are meaningless in isolation and you have
not got the remotest idea if they were invented or if these numbers
were random fluctuations while the vaccines were being developed.

There are huge wadges of data on polio rates worldwide and in detail
for the US from that time. There were several different vaccines and
several different attempts at mass inoculation during the 1950s.
Those numbers give two times points for 5 states. If the vaccine was
really is so useless, then this would show up as clear as daylight in
all of the stats. Yet, just for her book, she selected a few numbers
that went against the overall trend just to con gullible eejits like
you. If you look at the worldwide polio levels before and after the
1950s, you see polio being effectively eradicated in the Western
world. You clearly know absolutely zero about vaccines. You read the
page above which is just a web page posted on the net and you simply
believed it. You then turn this into a conspiracy by "the Ruling
Group" for world domination.

You believe the earth was hit by rogue planets recently because a
psychoanalyst said so.
You believe vaccines are bad because David Icke said so.
And why? Because these people are non-experts?

Just go to the Wikipedia pages on Polio and polio vaccines. It gives
basic easy to read details and a page of links and sources. I quote
two paragraphs for you:


From Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polio_vaccine

In 1952 and 1953, the U.S. experienced an outbreak of 58,000 and
35,000 polio cases, respectively, up from a typical number of some
20,000 a year. Amid this U.S. polio epidemic, millions of dollars were
invested in finding and marketing a polio vaccine by commercial
interests, including Lederle Laboratories in New York under the
direction of H. R. Cox. Also working at Lederle was Polish-born
virologist and immunologist Hilary Koprowski, who claims to have
created the first successful polio vaccine, in 1950. His vaccine,
however, a live attenuated virus taken orally, was still in the
research stage and would not be ready for use until five years after
Jonas Salk's polio vaccine (a dead injectable vaccine) had reached the
market.

The development of two polio vaccines led to the first modern mass
inoculations. The last cases of paralytic poliomyelitis caused by
endemic transmission of wild virus in the United States occurred in
1979, with an outbreak among the Amish in several Midwest states.[13]
A global effort to eradicate polio, led by the World Health
Organization, UNICEF, and The Rotary Foundation, began in 1988 and has
relied largely on the oral polio vaccine developed by Albert Sabin.
[14] The disease was entirely eradicated in the Americas by 1994.[15]
Polio was officially eradicated in 36 Western Pacific countries,
including China and Australia in 2000.[16][17] Europe was declared
polio-free in 2002.[18] As of 2008, polio remains endemic in only four
countries: Nigeria, India, Pakistan, and Afghanistan.[5] Although
poliovirus transmission has been interrupted in the much of the world,
transmission of wild poliovirus does continue and creates an ongoing
risk for the importation of wild poliovirus into previously polio-free
regions. If importations of poliovirus occurs, outbreaks of
poliomyelitis may develop, especially in areas with low vaccination
coverage and poor sanitation. As a result, high levels of vaccination
coverage must be maintained.[15]
Special Care
2009-10-05 14:33:45 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 5, 1:09 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
You believe the earth was hit by rogue planets recently because a
psychoanalyst said so.
------------------------------------------------------

No. The geological record, which nobody disputes, shows repeated
destructions of the surface of the earth in recent millennia, of such
a scale of violence and devastation that could only have been caused
by a sudden shifting of the earth's polar axis, for example Siberia
suddenly freezing over to preserve torrid zone animals under the newly
formed ice in mummified form, which in turn could only have been
caused by the presence of a full-sized planet passing close to earth.

------------------------------------------------------

I've said vaccination is not my emphasis, and you are demonstrating
why I don't want to get into that.
There is too much scope for endless obfuscating verbiage that will
always be inconclusive.

I want to concentrate on identifying core essential truths which are
beyond debate (except by saboteurs).
The advantage there is that the infiltrators/saboteurs will
immediately reveal themselves by their futile attempts to discredit
core essential truths.

Wikipedia is wide open to infiltration and sabotage, as demonstrated
recently by the sneaky removal of the factual references I had added
there, referring to the police/media insistence that there were two
men committing the series of murders known as the Yorkshire Ripper
killings - until Peter Sutcliffe was arrested, whereupon all mention
of the second ripper was dropped. For such a relevant FACT about the
Yorkshire Ripper case to be quietly deleted from Wikipedia can only
be down to infiltration/sabotage, since it is hugely relevant to any
report on the Yorkshire Ripper case to include the FACT that the media
and police themselves were repeatedly insisting prior to Sutcliffe's
arrest that there were not one but two Yorkshire Rippers.

So quoting Wikipedia is not a reliable guide to truth.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In fact this reminds me of George Orwell's "1984."

In the narrative, Winston Smith's job in the Ministry of Truth was
mainly to "correct" any inconsistencies in the archive of the only
surviving newspaper, the London "Times."

As all official government statistics are in the process of being
transferred to electronic/web form, Winston Smith's profession will
become a reality.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"And the Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS TRUTH?"

Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-05 15:32:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Oct 5, 1:09 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
You believe the earth was hit by rogue planets recently because a
psychoanalyst said so.
------------------------------------------------------
No. The geological record, which nobody disputes,
How would you know? You do not know anything about geology
Post by Special Care
shows repeated
destructions of the surface of the earth in recent millennia, of such
a scale of violence and devastation that could only have been caused
That is what the shrink says and I do not believe him. He took a few
bots of selected "facts" and dressed them up and exaggerated them
wildly and turned them into nutty scenarios and wrote big silly
books. You know, Velikovsky only makes sense to people who know
nothing about the subject.
Post by Special Care
by a sudden shifting of the earth's polar axis, for example Siberia
suddenly freezing over to preserve torrid zone animals under the newly
formed ice in mummified form, which in turn could only have been
caused by the presence of a full-sized planet passing close to earth.
Bollocks.
You do not like "experts" yet you believe Velikovsky. Surely he is an
"expert".
Post by Special Care
------------------------------------------------------
I've said vaccination is not my emphasis, and you are demonstrating
why I don't want to get into that.
There is too much scope for endless obfuscating verbiage that will
always be inconclusive.
Yes; I have noticed.
Post by Special Care
I want to concentrate on identifying core essential truths which are
beyond debate (except by saboteurs).
In literally hundreds of threads/posts by you, I have not seen you
come up with even one "truth" of any kind, much less ones that are
beyond debate. All the "truths" you come up with are plain silly.
They are not even sensible. You really think these are beyond
dispute? What does that mean?
Post by Special Care
The advantage there is that the infiltrators/saboteurs will
immediately reveal themselves by their futile attempts to discredit
core essential truths.
Wikipedia is wide open to infiltration and sabotage, as demonstrated
recently by the sneaky removal of the factual references I had added
there, referring to the police/media insistence that there were two
men committing the series of murders known as the Yorkshire Ripper
killings - until Peter Sutcliffe was arrested, whereupon all mention
of the second ripper was dropped. For such a relevant FACT about the
Yorkshire Ripper case to be quietly deleted  from Wikipedia can only
be down to infiltration/sabotage, since it is hugely relevant to any
report on the Yorkshire Ripper case to include the FACT that the media
and police themselves were repeatedly insisting prior to Sutcliffe's
arrest that there were not one but two Yorkshire Rippers.
So quoting Wikipedia is not a reliable guide to truth.
And you consider your "sources" reliable? Ok, how about:

http://www.accessexcellence.org/AE/AEC/CC/polio.php
http://inventors.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/aso/databank/entries/dm52sa.html
http://polio.emedtv.com/polio/polio-history.html

And how about you explaining how Polio was relatively common when you
were a child and is now more or less absent from the entire Western
world.
Post by Special Care
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In fact this reminds me of George Orwell's "1984."
In the narrative, Winston Smith's job in the Ministry of Truth was
mainly to "correct" any inconsistencies in the archive of the only
surviving newspaper, the London "Times."
As all official government statistics are in the process of being
transferred to electronic/web form, Winston Smith's profession will
become a reality.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"And the Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS http://youtu.be/VVjfPuXiwUg
Special Care
2009-10-05 17:36:27 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 5, 4:32 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Special Care
On Oct 5, 1:09 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
You believe the earth was hit by rogue planets recently because a
psychoanalyst said so.
------------------------------------------------------
No. The geological record, which nobody disputes,
How would you know?  You do not know anything about geology
Post by Special Care
shows repeated
destructions of the surface of the earth in recent millennia, of such
a scale of violence and devastation that could only have been caused
That is what the shrink says and I do not believe him.  He took a few
bots of selected "facts" and dressed them up and exaggerated them
wildly and turned them into nutty scenarios and wrote big silly
books.  You know, Velikovsky only makes sense to people who know
nothing about the subject.
Post by Special Care
by a sudden shifting of the earth's polar axis, for example Siberia
suddenly freezing over to preserve torrid zone animals under the newly
formed ice in mummified form, which in turn could only have been
caused by the presence of a full-sized planet passing close to earth.
Bollocks.
You do not like "experts" yet you believe Velikovsky.  Surely he is an
"expert".
Post by Special Care
------------------------------------------------------
I've said vaccination is not my emphasis, and you are demonstrating
why I don't want to get into that.
There is too much scope for endless obfuscating verbiage that will
always be inconclusive.
Yes; I have noticed.
Post by Special Care
I want to concentrate on identifying core essential truths which are
beyond debate (except by saboteurs).
In literally hundreds of threads/posts by you, I have not seen you
come up with even one "truth" of any kind, much less ones that are
beyond debate.  All the "truths" you come up with are plain silly.
They are not even sensible.    You really think these are beyond
dispute?  What does that mean?
Post by Special Care
The advantage there is that the infiltrators/saboteurs will
immediately reveal themselves by their futile attempts to discredit
core essential truths.
Wikipedia is wide open to infiltration and sabotage, as demonstrated
recently by the sneaky removal of the factual references I had added
there, referring to the police/media insistence that there were two
men committing the series of murders known as the Yorkshire Ripper
killings - until Peter Sutcliffe was arrested, whereupon all mention
of the second ripper was dropped. For such a relevant FACT about the
Yorkshire Ripper case to be quietly deleted  from Wikipedia can only
be down to infiltration/sabotage, since it is hugely relevant to any
report on the Yorkshire Ripper case to include the FACT that the media
and police themselves were repeatedly insisting prior to Sutcliffe's
arrest that there were not one but two Yorkshire Rippers.
So quoting Wikipedia is not a reliable guide to truth.
http://www.accessexcellence.org/AE/AEC/CC/polio.phphttp://inventors.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.pbs...http://polio.emedtv.com/polio/polio-history.html
And how about you explaining how Polio was relatively common when you
were a child and is now more or less absent from the entire Western
world.
Post by Special Care
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­------
In fact this reminds me of George Orwell's "1984."
In the narrative, Winston Smith's job in the Ministry of Truth was
mainly to "correct" any inconsistencies in the archive of the only
surviving newspaper, the London "Times."
As all official government statistics are in the process of being
transferred to electronic/web form, Winston Smith's profession will
become a reality.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­------
"And the Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS TRUTH?
"http://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=VVjfPuXiwUg&feature=PlayList&p=526415B...- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
===

Are you a *ruling group stooge* , or are you just frightened of the
Forbidden Subjects?

The geological record is not disputed, just ignored.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-05 18:32:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Oct 5, 4:32 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Special Care
On Oct 5, 1:09 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
You believe the earth was hit by rogue planets recently because a
psychoanalyst said so.
------------------------------------------------------
No. The geological record, which nobody disputes,
How would you know?  You do not know anything about geology
Post by Special Care
shows repeated
destructions of the surface of the earth in recent millennia, of such
a scale of violence and devastation that could only have been caused
That is what the shrink says and I do not believe him.  He took a few
bots of selected "facts" and dressed them up and exaggerated them
wildly and turned them into nutty scenarios and wrote big silly
books.  You know, Velikovsky only makes sense to people who know
nothing about the subject.
Post by Special Care
by a sudden shifting of the earth's polar axis, for example Siberia
suddenly freezing over to preserve torrid zone animals under the newly
formed ice in mummified form, which in turn could only have been
caused by the presence of a full-sized planet passing close to earth.
Bollocks.
You do not like "experts" yet you believe Velikovsky.  Surely he is an
"expert".
Post by Special Care
------------------------------------------------------
I've said vaccination is not my emphasis, and you are demonstrating
why I don't want to get into that.
There is too much scope for endless obfuscating verbiage that will
always be inconclusive.
Yes; I have noticed.
Post by Special Care
I want to concentrate on identifying core essential truths which are
beyond debate (except by saboteurs).
In literally hundreds of threads/posts by you, I have not seen you
come up with even one "truth" of any kind, much less ones that are
beyond debate.  All the "truths" you come up with are plain silly.
They are not even sensible.    You really think these are beyond
dispute?  What does that mean?
Post by Special Care
The advantage there is that the infiltrators/saboteurs will
immediately reveal themselves by their futile attempts to discredit
core essential truths.
Wikipedia is wide open to infiltration and sabotage, as demonstrated
recently by the sneaky removal of the factual references I had added
there, referring to the police/media insistence that there were two
men committing the series of murders known as the Yorkshire Ripper
killings - until Peter Sutcliffe was arrested, whereupon all mention
of the second ripper was dropped. For such a relevant FACT about the
Yorkshire Ripper case to be quietly deleted  from Wikipedia can only
be down to infiltration/sabotage, since it is hugely relevant to any
report on the Yorkshire Ripper case to include the FACT that the media
and police themselves were repeatedly insisting prior to Sutcliffe's
arrest that there were not one but two Yorkshire Rippers.
So quoting Wikipedia is not a reliable guide to truth.
http://www.accessexcellence.org/AE/AEC/CC/polio.phphttp://inventors.a...
And how about you explaining how Polio was relatively common when you
were a child and is now more or less absent from the entire Western
world.
Post by Special Care
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­------
In fact this reminds me of George Orwell's "1984."
In the narrative, Winston Smith's job in the Ministry of Truth was
mainly to "correct" any inconsistencies in the archive of the only
surviving newspaper, the London "Times."
As all official government statistics are in the process of being
transferred to electronic/web form, Winston Smith's profession will
become a reality.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­------
"And the Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS TRUTH?
"http://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=VVjfPuXiwUg&feature=PlayList&p=526415B...- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
===
Are you a *ruling group stooge* ,
They do not exist

or are you just frightened of the
Post by Special Care
Forbidden Subjects?
They do not exist
Post by Special Care
The geological record is not disputed, just ignored.- Hide quoted text -
You do not know anything about geology
Post by Special Care
- Show quoted text -
Special Care
2009-10-05 20:31:23 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 5, 7:32 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
<***@gmail.com> wrote:
­­­------
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
Post by Special Care
"And the Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS TRUTH?
"http://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=VVjfPuXiwUg&feature=PlayList&p=526415B...
===
Are you a *ruling group stooge* ,
They do not exist
or are you just frightened of the
Post by Special Care
Forbidden Subjects?
They do not exist
Post by Special Care
The geological record is not disputed, just ignored.
You do not know anything about geology
--------------------------------------------

I'll just relate some anecdotal evidence to you then.

After my first child was born, I was very enthusiastic about measuring
his progress, such as walking, balance, vocabulary, learning skills,
and so on. It was a great adventure for an enthusiastic and proud
father..........................................

But then.............................................

When my beloved son was about nine months of age, I noticed that his
progress at all those measurements of development ground to an abrupt
and mysterious halt..................................

A year later, I discovered that my wife's mother had had my son
vaccinated without my permission.

The date of the vaccinations coincided EXACTLY with the date of the
slowdown in my son's progress in achieving life skills.

How many other families can tell the same story, with our without my
meticulous record keeping?

This is a terrible personal heartbreak for me.

I tried so hard to protect my baby from the poisoned needle.

But my wife's mother was and is a brain dead shite, and she took my
baby away from me while I was not there to protect him, and got the
brain-dead morons in the poison centre to fill my baby full of
poisons... and so immediately after that I measured a sudden
deterioration in my baby's learning progress.....

How many other families will tell you the same story, if you enquire?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"And The Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS TRUTH?"
http://youtu.be/VVjfPuXiwUg
Special Care
2009-10-05 22:01:54 UTC
Permalink
Tomorrow belongs to ............... ?

Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-05 22:16:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
­­­------
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
Post by Special Care
"And the Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS TRUTH?
"http://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=VVjfPuXiwUg&feature=PlayList&p=526415B...
===
Are you a *ruling group stooge* ,
They do not exist
or are you just frightened of the
Post by Special Care
Forbidden Subjects?
They do not exist
Post by Special Care
The geological record is not disputed, just ignored.
You do not know anything about geology
--------------------------------------------
I'll just relate some anecdotal evidence to you then.
After my first child was born, I was very enthusiastic about measuring
his progress, such as walking, balance, vocabulary, learning skills,
and so on. It was a great adventure for an enthusiastic and proud
father..........................................
But then.............................................
When my beloved son was about nine months of age, I noticed that his
progress at all those measurements of development ground to an abrupt
and mysterious halt..................................
A year later, I discovered that my wife's mother had had my son
vaccinated without my permission.
The date of the vaccinations coincided EXACTLY with the date of the
slowdown in my son's progress in achieving life skills.
How many other families can tell the same story, with our without my
meticulous record keeping?
This is a terrible personal heartbreak for me.
I tried so hard to protect my baby from the poisoned needle.
But my wife's mother was and is a brain dead shite, and she took my
baby away from me while I was not there to protect him, and got the
brain-dead morons in the poison centre to fill my baby full of
poisons... and so immediately after that I measured a sudden
deterioration in my baby's learning progress.....
How many other families will tell  you the same story, if you enquire?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­------------------
"And The Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS http://youtu.be/VVjfPuXiwUg Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
So do you belive that the vaccine is a poison that is designed as such
(perhaps by some mysterious ruling elite, who are poossibly lizards
but maybe not) for purposes of mind control? What is in the vccine
then?
Special Care
2009-10-06 10:08:06 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 5, 11:16 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
­­­------
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
Post by Special Care
"And the Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS TRUTH?
"http://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=VVjfPuXiwUg&feature=PlayList&p=526415B...
===
Are you a *ruling group stooge* ,
They do not exist
or are you just frightened of the
Post by Special Care
Forbidden Subjects?
They do not exist
Post by Special Care
The geological record is not disputed, just ignored.
You do not know anything about geology
--------------------------------------------
I'll just relate some anecdotal evidence to you then.
After my first child was born, I was very enthusiastic about measuring
his progress, such as walking, balance, vocabulary, learning skills,
and so on. It was a great adventure for an enthusiastic and proud
father..........................................
But then.............................................
When my beloved son was about nine months of age, I noticed that his
progress at all those measurements of development ground to an abrupt
and mysterious halt..................................
A year later, I discovered that my wife's mother had had my son
vaccinated without my permission.
The date of the vaccinations coincided EXACTLY with the date of the
slowdown in my son's progress in achieving life skills.
How many other families can tell the same story, with our without my
meticulous record keeping?
This is a terrible personal heartbreak for me.
I tried so hard to protect my baby from the poisoned needle.
But my wife's mother was and is a brain dead shite, and she took my
baby away from me while I was not there to protect him, and got the
brain-dead morons in the poison centre to fill my baby full of
poisons... and so immediately after that I measured a sudden
deterioration in my baby's learning progress.....
How many other families will tell  you the same story, if you enquire?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­------------------
"And The Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS http://youtu.be/VVjfPuXiwUg quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
So do you belive that the vaccine is a poison that is designed as such
(perhaps by some mysterious ruling elite, who are poossibly lizards
but maybe not) for purposes of mind control?   What is in the vccine
then?- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
-----------------------------------------------------

They don't try to conceal what is in the vaccines.
The original motive was to make money, as it became clear to the
medical gangsters that the human population have a deep-seated need to
be told what to believe by "experts," and a terror of thinking for
themselves, which is rooted in the forgotten survivalist emergences
which drove us insane in the first place.

But now there is a new dimension to it.
There is an agenda of reversion to full-scale dictatorship worldwide,
which is a pathological collective repetition compulsion. Vaccines and
other "animal tested" [=untested] poisons 'dumb us down' and drain our
courage out of us, making it easier to implement the agenda of
reversion to full-scale dictatorship. The vote for full-scale
dictatorship in Ireland last Friday was part of the ongoing agenda,
and it's what the Irish people and all others want.

It's NOT an 'us v. them' scenario. It's collusion. It's collective
mental illness.
----------------------------------------------------
REPRODUCED FROM ARCHIVE:

==========================================

If you see it clearly, typing it in a public place, as I do, gives a
slight feeling of relief, at least.

It's not that anything can be done to reverse what we are doing.
And yes, it IS *we* /
There is no "us v. them."
This is NOT a case of an evil, corrupt ruling group cruelly
exploiting
and poisoning us.
The deafening silence of 1990 gave the lie to that, as well as the
lack of effective opposition since then.
No, we all are doing this together.

The ruling group are "proactive" in poisoning our bodies and our
ecosphere, restoring full-scale dictatorship and instigating a third
world war,
but WE, you and I, are the ENABLERS, colluding with the ruling group
by offering only a token, deliberately ineffective resistance.

I am reminded of the "young lady saying no when she means yes"
syndrome. My girlfriends often enjoyed being overpowered by me, while
vocally protesting and squirming a little bit to "try to escape,"
thus
saving their ladylike honour by having resisted before finally and
gladly submitting to some "disgraceful" sex act....

That's what's happening now on a global scale.
There are some quite loud protests, for example that guy in
Argentina,
see link below...
But it's all ballyhoo. It's deliberately ineffective.
We are colluding, we are the *enablers* of what the ruling group are
actively doing.
We all share the collective death wish, the collective compulsion to
recreate and relive the ancient catastrophes and the the survivalist
emergencies and vicious wars that followed.

If we all faced it fully, in both the intellect and the emotions,
we'd
be able to stop ourselves from doing this to ourselves and to each
other.

See also "Mankind in Amnesia" at link below.

You will feel better if you type the truth about us in a public
place,
as I do.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­--------
AN EXAMPLE OF OUR DELIBERATELY INEFFECTIVE "OPPOSITION" /
SAYING NO WHEN WE MEAN YES:
http://youtu.be/2iPPfOKyayg

"Mankind in Amnesia"
http://www.knowledge.co.uk/velikovsky/mankind.htm

"Know Yourself, Heal Yourself"
http://docs.google.com/View?docid=dddp6bt4_829zpt8ffd
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-06 21:49:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Oct 5, 11:16 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
­­­------
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
Post by Special Care
"And the Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS TRUTH?
"http://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=VVjfPuXiwUg&feature=PlayList&p=526415B...
===
Are you a *ruling group stooge* ,
They do not exist
or are you just frightened of the
Post by Special Care
Forbidden Subjects?
They do not exist
Post by Special Care
The geological record is not disputed, just ignored.
You do not know anything about geology
--------------------------------------------
I'll just relate some anecdotal evidence to you then.
After my first child was born, I was very enthusiastic about measuring
his progress, such as walking, balance, vocabulary, learning skills,
and so on. It was a great adventure for an enthusiastic and proud
father..........................................
But then.............................................
When my beloved son was about nine months of age, I noticed that his
progress at all those measurements of development ground to an abrupt
and mysterious halt..................................
A year later, I discovered that my wife's mother had had my son
vaccinated without my permission.
The date of the vaccinations coincided EXACTLY with the date of the
slowdown in my son's progress in achieving life skills.
How many other families can tell the same story, with our without my
meticulous record keeping?
This is a terrible personal heartbreak for me.
I tried so hard to protect my baby from the poisoned needle.
But my wife's mother was and is a brain dead shite, and she took my
baby away from me while I was not there to protect him, and got the
brain-dead morons in the poison centre to fill my baby full of
poisons... and so immediately after that I measured a sudden
deterioration in my baby's learning progress.....
How many other families will tell  you the same story, if you enquire?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­­------------------
"And The Lonely Voice of Youth Cries: WHAT IS http://youtu.be/VVjfPuXiwUg text -
- Show quoted text -
So do you belive that the vaccine is a poison that is designed as such
(perhaps by some mysterious ruling elite, who are poossibly lizards
but maybe not) for purposes of mind control?   What is in the vccine
then?- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
-----------------------------------------------------
They don't try to conceal what is in the vaccines.
So what is in them then? You sem to be so knowledgeable about the
subject.
Post by Special Care
The original motive was to make money, as it became clear to the
medical gangsters that the human population have a deep-seated need to
be told what to believe by "experts," and a terror of thinking for
themselves, which is rooted in the forgotten survivalist emergences
which drove us insane in the first place.
So you do not believe that vaccines work then?

snip (a load of irrelevant silly stuff)
Special Care
2009-10-07 10:28:48 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 6, 10:49 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Special Care
-----------------------------------------------------
They don't try to conceal what is in the vaccines.
So what is in them then?  You sem to be so knowledgeable about the
subject.
Post by Special Care
The original motive was to make money, as it became clear to the
medical gangsters that the human population have a deep-seated need to
be told what to believe by "experts," and a terror of thinking for
themselves, which is rooted in the forgotten survivalist emergences
which drove us insane in the first place.
So you do not believe that vaccines work then?
------------------------------------------------------------------

I read about what's in vaccines but it's so disgusting that I
preferred to forget it.

This subject is non-essential to my main emphasis.

I thought it was obvious that I don't believe that vaccines work, and
I have that first-hand experience of seeing my baby's progress at
developing life skills suddenly coming to a halt at the time of
vaccination, when nothing else had changed, so the vaccines were the
cause. That can only signify damage to the brain, luckily not severe
in this case. I took the time to keep meticulous records of his
development. If other families did the same, I would expect similar
observations.

The original post here was not primarily about whether vaccines work
or not, but referred to the fact that if we no longer have any say or
any right to refuse whatever substances government officials want to
inject into our bodies and our babies' bodies, then we have lost such
a fundamental freedom that we may as well just lie down where we stand
and wait for death to come to us - because we are as good as dead if
we give other people the power to inject whatever they like into our
bodies and our babies' bodies. You surrender your soul as well as your
body if you let them take that power over you.

And the fact that no serious or effective resistance is being offered
to that plan is indicative of collective mental impairment, which in
turn becomes intelligible and understandable if we think clearly about
*the psychology of the survivalist emergency* - which is where our
mental impairment comes from.

Governments have no power except the power you let them take from you.
But they know we have a deep-seated need to be dictated to, because
full-scale dictatorship long ago became associated in our brains and
in our archetypes with physical survival.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-07 12:58:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Oct 6, 10:49 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Special Care
-----------------------------------------------------
They don't try to conceal what is in the vaccines.
So what is in them then?  You sem to be so knowledgeable about the
subject.
Post by Special Care
The original motive was to make money, as it became clear to the
medical gangsters that the human population have a deep-seated need to
be told what to believe by "experts," and a terror of thinking for
themselves, which is rooted in the forgotten survivalist emergences
which drove us insane in the first place.
So you do not believe that vaccines work then?
------------------------------------------------------------------
I read about what's in vaccines but it's so disgusting that I
preferred to forget it.
So you don't know then?
You seemed to imply earlier that vaccines were part of a system of
mind control of some kind. That is what your here Icke thinks? I
wondered then, what exactly was teh cause of this amazing effect.
I see you have no idea so I suppose it is pointless to ask further.
Post by Special Care
This subject is non-essential to my main emphasis.
This is surreal. You are complaining about vaccines. In this
context, the ONLY thing that is essential to a sensible discussion
about vaccines is what is in them. The rest is you and your paranoia.
Post by Special Care
I thought it was obvious that I don't believe that vaccines work, and
I have that first-hand experience of seeing my baby's progress at
developing life skills suddenly coming to a halt at the time of
vaccination, when nothing else had changed, so the vaccines were the
cause.
I do not believe you. Given what you have written to date on this
newsgroup, that I have read, I would not consider you a reliable
witness of anything. One supposed data point proves zero. The
entire MMR and Autism link furore went on for 10 years due to supposed
links like the one you described. Yet when non-vaccinated and
vaccinated kids were compared, there was NO difference. I am afraid,
that kids change for all kinds of reasons and parents imagine all
kinds of links that do not exist.

I could claim that within a week of my kids being vaccinated, they
both perked up enormously and developed tremendously over the next 4
weeks. Would you believe me if I claimed that?
Post by Special Care
That can only signify damage to the brain, luckily not severe
in this case. I took the time to keep meticulous records of his
Yes, at least you are honest here. You probably do have a damaged
brain.
Special Care
2009-10-07 13:57:36 UTC
Permalink
You seem to be making a little hobby for yourself here.

You're selective about which items you reply to. But saying something
is 'surreal' is only a label and an avoidance, unless it's backed up
with evidence/facts.

I'm glad you answered me as it helps me to identify more clearly and
focus better on what I want to focus on, which is clarifying as
succinctly as possible an analysis of the human condition, along with
the healing formula that analysis points to, which will rely solely on
core essential truths which are beyond dispute, easily understandable
to anyone even without formal education, and not needing verification
by 'experts.'
That is the only way we can heal our civilisation, because 'experts'
depend for funding on grants from governments or 'foundations' linked
to vivisectionist interests, so 'experts' are condemned to oppose
healing our civilisation if they need to keep their jobs.

A protracted, complex debate on vaccines is not part of such a
succinct "expert-proof" analysis of our condition.

And you haven't mentioned the point of the original post here, which
was to say that if we give to governments the power to inject into our
bodies and our babies' bodies any substance they choose to inject into
us, well then we may as well be dead.

I place information on vaccines here and there because most people are
complacent about medical matters, when they should take nothing for
granted. They need to ask "who gains?" and to remember that there is
money to be made from sickness, the more the merrier for the
profiteers, and there's not much money to be made from a healthy
population.
Profit is the overriding dynamic of our civilisation. The more
sickness there is, the more money to be made. "Who gains?"
They should also remember that a brain-damaged population is more
manageable and more amenable to the step-by-step reversion to full-
scale dictatorship worldwide, which is close to realisation now
following last week's bizarre vote in Ireland.
The EU constitution does not pretend to be other than a blueprint for
the abolition of the bit of democracy we had and the establishment of
the Europe-wide Empire that Hitler and Napoleon failed to achieve by
force. Ratcheting up the concentration of "animal tested" [=untested]
poisons in our brains will make us even more compliant.
Always ask "who gains?"

The following are some more vaccine-related youtube links. If people
are busy they can start the video then minimise the picture and listen
to the sound (however, one of the following is in writing with only
instrumental music for sound):
[RON PAUL]




Special Care
2009-10-07 14:22:01 UTC
Permalink
Money makes the world go around:



Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-07 14:51:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
You seem to be making a little hobby for yourself here.
You're selective about which items you reply to. But saying something
is 'surreal' is only a label and an avoidance, unless it's backed up
with evidence/facts.
I do not reply to the crazy stuff because there is nothing to reply
to. You cannot reply sensibly to a delusion. I reply to stuff about
vaccines because that is concrete and you know nothing about them but
spout on and on about them as if you do. When I then press you on
specific points you change the subject.
Post by Special Care
I'm glad you answered me as it helps me to identify more clearly and
focus better on what I want to focus on, which is clarifying as
succinctly as possible an analysis of the human condition, along with
the healing formula that analysis points to, which will rely solely on
core essential truths which are beyond dispute, easily understandable
to anyone even without formal education, and not needing verification
by 'experts.'
That is the only way we can heal our civilisation, because 'experts'
depend for funding on grants from governments or 'foundations' linked
to vivisectionist interests, so 'experts' are condemned to oppose
healing our civilisation if they need to keep their jobs.
A protracted, complex debate on vaccines is not part of such a
succinct "expert-proof" analysis of our condition.
It is funny. You always say that whenever I press you on facts. You
do not know many real facts do you.
Whenever you bring up a silly supposedly factual point, I should you
why it is silly and you say ohhh it is not important.
Post by Special Care
And you haven't mentioned the point of the original post here, which
was to say that if we give to governments the power to inject into our
bodies and our babies' bodies any substance they choose to inject into
us, well then we may as well be dead.
You can choose not to be vaccinated.
Post by Special Care
I place information on vaccines here and there because most people are
complacent about medical matters, when they should take nothing for
granted. They need to ask "who gains?" and to remember that there is
money to be made from sickness, the more the merrier for the
profiteers, and there's not much money to be made from a healthy
population.
Profit is the overriding dynamic of our civilisation. The more
sickness there is, the more money to be made. "Who gains?"
This is ironic. Vaccines stop disease. Vaccines make a small amount
of money but drug companies would make much more if vaccines did not
exist. You have this back to front.
Post by Special Care
They should also remember that a brain-damaged population is more
manageable and more amenable to the step-by-step reversion to full-
scale dictatorship worldwide, which is close to realisation now
following last week's bizarre vote in Ireland.
The EU constitution does not pretend to be other than a blueprint for
the abolition of the bit of democracy we had and the establishment of
the Europe-wide Empire that Hitler and Napoleon failed to achieve by
force. Ratcheting up the concentration of "animal tested" [=untested]
poisons in our brains will make us even more compliant.
Always ask "who gains?"
The following are some more vaccine-related youtube links. If people
are busy they can start the video then minimise the picture and listen
to the sound (however, one of the following is in writing with only
Oh now you want me to watch more fruitcake looney videos for you.
Tell me what they say, in your own words. Otherwise, life is too
short.
Post by Special Care
instrumental music for http://youtu.be/QJiTStZtrlE PAUL]
http://youtu.be/B4SmFxyust0
http://youtu.be/CDR-UJYms6w
Special Care
2009-10-07 17:58:17 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 7, 3:51 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Special Care
A protracted, complex debate on vaccines is not part of such a
succinct "expert-proof" analysis of our condition.
It is funny.  You always say that whenever I press you on facts.  You
do not know many real facts do you.
Whenever you bring up a silly supposedly factual point, I should you
why it is silly and you say ohhh it is not important.
Post by Special Care
And you haven't mentioned the point of the original post here, which
was to say that if we give to governments the power to inject into our
bodies and our babies' bodies any substance they choose to inject into
us, well then we may as well be dead.
You can choose not to be vaccinated.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

For how much longer?

What prompted the orginal post above was the news from Massachusetts
that a law has already been passed there to make non-compliance with
vaccine rules punishable with thirty days in jail and fines that will
bankrupt and make homeless anyone other than the super rich.
http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-in-jail-for-refusing-the-swine-flu-vaccine-in-massachusetts

That is how the ruling group operate this step-by-step reversion to
full-scale dictatorship worldwide.... test the 'temperature' in one
area (incidentally an area with plenty of Irish Catholics, noted on
the whole for submission to authority of any kind)
and then if it passes without effective resistance in one region they
can present other regions with this fait accompli and browbeat them
with all the usual threats and guilt tripping, backed up by the
National Guard in USA...

Why do you think the fiery idealism of the 1960s civil rights protests
has never been repeated, except in a dimmed down and dumbed down form?
Brain damage. The ruling group's sneaky response was to ratchet up the
concentration of "animal tested" [=untested] poisons in our brains, to
befog our wits and sap our courage.
Anyone over the age of 50 has witnessed that decline in both our
intellectual capacity and our self respect.
Post by Special Care
http://youtu.be/QJiTStZtrlE PAUL]
http://youtu.be/B4SmFxyust0
http://youtu.be/CDR-UJYms6w
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-07 18:59:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Oct 7, 3:51 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Special Care
A protracted, complex debate on vaccines is not part of such a
succinct "expert-proof" analysis of our condition.
It is funny.  You always say that whenever I press you on facts.  You
do not know many real facts do you.
Whenever you bring up a silly supposedly factual point, I should you
why it is silly and you say ohhh it is not important.
Post by Special Care
And you haven't mentioned the point of the original post here, which
was to say that if we give to governments the power to inject into our
bodies and our babies' bodies any substance they choose to inject into
us, well then we may as well be dead.
You can choose not to be vaccinated.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­--
For how much longer?
What prompted the orginal post above was the news from Massachusetts
that a law has already been passed there to make non-compliance with
vaccine rules punishable with thirty days in jail and fines that will
bankrupt and make homeless anyone other than the super rich.http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-...
You believe everything you read you gullible eejit as long as it is
written on some looney blog.
That is a hoax FFS. That law has not been passed. This is crazy.
You use as your only sources of information, crazy shite that people
just make up and post on a web site.


snipped more silly shite
Special Care
2009-10-07 19:30:10 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 7, 7:59 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
You can choose not to be vaccinated.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­--
For how much longer?
What prompted the orginal post above was the news from Massachusetts
that a law has already been passed there to make non-compliance with
vaccine rules punishable with thirty days in jail and fines that will
bankrupt and make homeless anyone other than the super rich.http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-...
You believe everything you read you gullible eejit as long as it is
written on some looney blog.
That is a hoax FFS.  That law has not been passed.  This is crazy.
You use as your only sources of information, crazy shite that people
just make up and post on a web site.
snipped more silly shite
=============
The so-called "disease" of measles is often a beneficial healing
crisis, the body throwing off its toxins, with accompanying health-
giving discomfort.

*Intelligent leaving alone* - is often the best response to bodily
discomfort.

In a world full of poisons, you can expect bodily discomfort as the
somatic intelligence seeks a way of coping with the endless onslaught
from "animal tested" [=untested] poisons.
------------------------------------------------------

Without a contact 'on the ground' in Boston, it's difficult to get the
complete picture.
But this piece from the official website of the 'Boston Globe' bears
out my description of a ruling group "testing the temperature" to see
if this sort of "ratcheting up" of the reversion to full-scale
dictatorship will meet with any effective resistance in one region,
for a start.
http://www.boston.com/news/health/articles/2009/09/17/in_public_health_bill_a_contagion_of_fear/
Special Care
2009-10-07 19:46:33 UTC
Permalink

Feel I'm goin' back to Massachusetts,
Something's telling me I must go home.
And the lights all went out in Massachusetts
The day I left her standing on her own.

Tried to hitch a ride to San Francisco,
Gotta do the things I wanna do.
And the lights all went out in Massachusetts
They brought me back to see my way with you.

Talk about the life in Massachusetts,
Speak about the people I have seen,
And the lights all went out in Massachusetts
And Massachusetts is one place I have seen.

I will remember Massachusetts...

http://vaccinationinjury.com/program.html

http://multimedia.boston.com/m/26636642/health-care-workers-opt-out-of-h1n1-vaccinations.htm?q=vaccination+law&index=1&seek=103.439
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-07 19:54:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Oct 7, 7:59 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
You can choose not to be vaccinated.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­­--
For how much longer?
What prompted the orginal post above was the news from Massachusetts
that a law has already been passed there to make non-compliance with
vaccine rules punishable with thirty days in jail and fines that will
bankrupt and make homeless anyone other than the super rich.http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-...
You believe everything you read you gullible eejit as long as it is
written on some looney blog.
That is a hoax FFS.  That law has not been passed.  This is crazy.
You use as your only sources of information, crazy shite that people
just make up and post on a web site.
snipped more silly shite
=============
The so-called "disease" of measles is often a beneficial healing
crisis, the body throwing off its toxins, with accompanying health-
giving discomfort.
That is invented meaningless mumbo jumbo.
Did you just make that up?
Post by Special Care
*Intelligent leaving alone* - is often the best response to bodily
discomfort.
In a world full of poisons, you can expect bodily discomfort as the
somatic intelligence seeks a way of coping with the endless onslaught
from "animal tested" [=untested] poisons.
------------------------------------------------------
Without a contact 'on the ground' in Boston, it's difficult to get the
complete picture.
But this piece from the official website of the 'Boston Globe' bears
out my description of a ruling group "testing the temperature" to see
if this sort of "ratcheting up" of the reversion to full-scale
dictatorship will meet with any effective resistance in one region,
for a start.http://www.boston.com/news/health/articles/2009/09/17/in_public_healt...- Hide quoted text -
That article says exactly the opposite to what you describe. It
points out thata there is no plan to compell people to be vaccinated.
It is all hot air and stean generated purely by conspiracy nuts.

Read it again, slowly. Here are some sentences to help you:

"Those concerns, public health authorities insist, are entirely
unfounded. But the association’s multimedia campaign - aired over talk
radio and its website - compelled state Public Health Commissioner
John Auerbach to send an italicized, bold-faced missive to
legislators, stressing that “mandatory vaccination is not and has
never been part of the plan or discussion in Massachusetts’ pandemic
response.’’

There is no mandatory vaccination law. That blog you read is fiction
and it has been repeated over and over on dozens of other looney blogs
and onto youtube. It is noise and misinformation. It is hysteria
with no basis in reality of any kind.

Ruling group me arse.
Special Care
2009-10-07 20:06:48 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 7, 8:54 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Special Care
But this piece from the official website of the 'Boston Globe' bears
out my description of a ruling group "testing the temperature" to see
if this sort of "ratcheting up" of the reversion to full-scale
dictatorship will meet with any effective resistance in one region,
for a start.http://www.boston.com/news/health/articles/2009/09/17/in_public_healt...Hide quoted text -
That article says exactly the opposite to what you describe.  It
points out thata there is no plan to compell people to be vaccinated.
It is all hot air and stean generated purely by conspiracy nuts.
"Those concerns, public health authorities insist, are entirely
unfounded. But the association’s multimedia campaign - aired over talk
radio and its website - compelled state Public Health Commissioner
John Auerbach to send an italicized, bold-faced missive to
legislators, stressing that “mandatory vaccination is not and has
never been part of the plan or discussion in Massachusetts’ pandemic
response.’’
---------------------------------------------

Well I don't know where you've been all your life. Are you living in
the Connemara Gaeltacht? Or Achill Island?

Have you not yet discovered how the world works?

For example, how many times have you heard politicians saying the EU
constitution is "just a tidying up exercise" ..... "to streamline
decision making" ........... do you not understand the code words yet?
And the collusion between rulers and ruled because we all have this
collective death wish and collective repetition compulsion?
Seth
2009-10-08 15:04:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
What prompted the orginal post above was the news from Massachusetts
that a law has already been passed there to make non-compliance with
vaccine rules punishable with thirty days in jail and fines that will
bankrupt and make homeless anyone other than the super rich.
http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-in-jail-for-refusing-the-swine-flu-vaccine-in-massachusetts
If the law was actually passed, you'd be able to provide a URL
pointing to a government web site with information about laws, rather
than a domain created a few months ago with a freemail account as the
contact.

Seth
Special Care
2009-10-08 16:50:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Seth
Post by Special Care
What prompted the orginal post above was the news from Massachusetts
that a law has already been passed there to make non-compliance with
vaccine rules punishable with thirty days in jail and fines that will
bankrupt and make homeless anyone other than the super rich.
http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-...
If the law was actually passed, you'd be able to provide a URL
pointing to a government web site with information about laws, rather
than a domain created a few months ago with a freemail account as the
contact.
Seth
-------------------------------------

I didn't look for such a URL because this is not my emphasis.

The purpose was to prompt people to be wary about what they allow to
be injected into their bodies, and also to show how the ruling group
"test the temperature" to see how far they can go in ratcheting up the
reversion to full-scale dictatorship.

The Irish vote and the Czech compliance complete the surrender of the
people of Europe to reversing the outcome of World War Two.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-08 20:09:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
Post by Seth
Post by Special Care
What prompted the orginal post above was the news from Massachusetts
that a law has already been passed there to make non-compliance with
vaccine rules punishable with thirty days in jail and fines that will
bankrupt and make homeless anyone other than the super rich.
http://thebirdflupandemic.com/archives/1000-per-day-fine-and-30-days-...
If the law was actually passed, you'd be able to provide a URL
pointing to a government web site with information about laws, rather
than a domain created a few months ago with a freemail account as the
contact.
Seth
-------------------------------------
I didn't look for such a URL because this is not my emphasis.
Your emphasis is usually to shy away from facts as fast as you can
type and to retreat to smokescreens of imaginary conspiracies as soon
as anyone answers anything you write. There is no plan to enforce
vaccinations and there never was. Someone just made this shite up and
you believed it, as you always believe this rubbish. It shows nothing
except how little truth matters to you and to the people who made this
stuff up.

The stuff you choose to believe is nuts and you have a messiah
complex.

There is no ruiling group; this is childish paranoia.
Post by Special Care
The purpose was to prompt people to be wary about what they allow to
be injected into their bodies, and also to show how the ruling group
"test the temperature" to see how far they can go in ratcheting up the
reversion to full-scale dictatorship.
The Irish vote and the Czech compliance complete the surrender of the
people of Europe to reversing the outcome of World War Two.
Special Care
2009-10-09 19:26:18 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 8, 9:09 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Your emphasis is usually to shy away from facts as fast as you can
type and to retreat to smokescreens of imaginary conspiracies as soon
as anyone answers anything you write.  There is no plan to enforce
vaccinations and there never was.  Someone just made this shite up and
you believed it, as you always believe this rubbish.  It shows nothing
except how little truth matters to you and to the people who made this
stuff up.
The stuff you choose to believe is nuts and you have a messiah
complex.
There is no ruiling group; this is childish paranoia.
==========

Well even if I did have a "messiah complex," that in itself would not
be a valid ground for citicising me, and is only another labelling /
mudslinging / heckling action....

I didn't say I'm a messiah. I do see myself as contributing to
healing, as are many others.

I keep telling you I don't want to argue in detail about vaccination
because it's a subject that lends itself to a debate full of endless
inconclusive verbiage, a debate which cannot be won and cannot be
lost.

So yes, I avoid it, because such a no-win-no-lose debate full of
endless inconclusive verbiage is a barrier to healing, and healling is
what our civilisation urgently needs.
So yes, I do avoid any dead-end debate which is a distraction from the
healing of our civilisation.

After a while, when the motivation is there, I'll write a more
succinct account of the core essential truths that comprise the
correct analysis of the human condition and the only valid long-term
healing formula toward which that basic analysis points us.

It's difficult to find the motivation to tidy up those writings,
because healing is not going to happen in my lifetime.

In short, as we might say in Dublin.....

...nobody gives a shite about anything.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-10 12:40:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Oct 8, 9:09 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Your emphasis is usually to shy away from facts as fast as you can
type and to retreat to smokescreens of imaginary conspiracies as soon
as anyone answers anything you write.  There is no plan to enforce
vaccinations and there never was.  Someone just made this shite up and
you believed it, as you always believe this rubbish.  It shows nothing
except how little truth matters to you and to the people who made this
stuff up.
The stuff you choose to believe is nuts and you have a messiah
complex.
There is no ruiling group; this is childish paranoia.
==========
Well even if I did have a "messiah complex," that in itself would not
be a valid ground for citicising me, and is only another labelling /
mudslinging / heckling action....
I didn't say I'm a messiah. I do see myself as contributing to
healing, as are many others.
Messiah complex!
Post by Special Care
I keep telling you I don't want to argue in detail about vaccination
because it's a subject that lends itself to a debate full of endless
inconclusive verbiage, a debate which cannot be won and cannot be
lost.
"endless constant verbiage"??? That is ironic coming from you. What
have you been doing for the past few years?

You use "facts" when it suits you but then try to erect smokescreens
when challenged on them. Then you try to say that you cannot debate
it. What is there to debate? Crazy shite from looney blogs that has
been blatantly invented?
Post by Special Care
So yes, I avoid it, because such a no-win-no-lose debate full of
endless inconclusive verbiage is a barrier to healing, and healling is
what our civilisation urgently needs.
It in only inconclusive because you refuse to belive obvious simple
facts and immerse yourself in fantasy nonesense. Velikovsky made all
that shite up. It is a scam!!
Post by Special Care
So yes, I do avoid any dead-end debate which is a distraction from the
healing of our civilisation.
After a while, when the motivation is there, I'll write a more
succinct account of the core essential truths that comprise the
correct analysis of the human condition and the only valid long-term
healing formula toward which that basic analysis points us.
It's difficult to find the motivation to tidy up those writings,
because healing is not going to happen in my lifetime.
In short, as we might say in Dublin.....
...nobody gives a shite about anything.
On the contrary, people care intensely. Maybe people are not as mad
as you like to think they are.
Maybe they simply do not believe anything you say.
Special Care
2009-10-10 13:38:28 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 10, 1:40 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
It in only inconclusive because you refuse to belive obvious simple
facts and immerse yourself in fantasy nonesense.  Velikovsky made all
that shite up.  It is a scam!!
<>.........<>............
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
In short, as we might say in Dublin.....
...nobody gives a shite about anything.
On the contrary, people care intensely.  Maybe people are not as mad
as you like to think they are.
Maybe they simply do not believe anything you say.
===========================

Well, I'm not sure what you want.

My opinion is that you are not a *ruling group stooge* - because the
policy of the ruling group is to ignore people who speak the truth. If
you reply to people who speak the truth, you make them stronger by
drawing public attention to them and by giving them the motivation to
reply and thereby to become more articulate and more fluent in their
contribution to healing. For those reasons I believe you are not a
*ruling group stooge* but are a bored Irishman who likes to flex his
intellectual muscles.

It's easy to snipe at Dr Immanuel Velikovsky by ridiculing some parts
of "Worlds In Collision," and there will be people out there to
applaud you for doing so, because the information is disturbing.

However, Velikovsky did not invent the universally accepted and agreed
geological record - as he quoted in "Earth In Upheaval."

I take it you have not read in full any of his three principal books.
He foresaw that people would criticise his books without reading them.

He did not invent the universally accepted geological record as quoted
here:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Mass Scotoma Rides Again"
http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_175d3cpt7cd

The Trilogy of Truth (Immanuel Velikovsky)
http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_8d2hnhqgs
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-10 14:10:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
It in only inconclusive because you refuse to belive obvious simple
facts and immerse yourself in fantasy nonesense.  Velikovsky made all
that shite up.  It is a scam!!
<>.........<>............
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
In short, as we might say in Dublin.....
...nobody gives a shite about anything.
On the contrary, people care intensely.  Maybe people are not as mad
as you like to think they are.
Maybe they simply do not believe anything you say.
===========================
Well, I'm not sure what you want.
My opinion is that you are not a *ruling group stooge* - because the
policy of the ruling group is to ignore people who speak the truth. If
you reply to people who speak the truth, you make them stronger by
drawing public attention to them and by giving them the motivation to
reply and thereby to become more articulate and more fluent in their
contribution to healing. For those reasons I believe you are not a
*ruling group stooge* but are a bored Irishman who likes to flex his
intellectual muscles.
It's easy to snipe at Dr Immanuel Velikovsky by ridiculing some parts
of "Worlds In Collision," and there will be people out there to
applaud you for doing so, because the information is disturbing.
However, Velikovsky did not invent the universally accepted and agreed
geological record - as he quoted in "Earth In Upheaval."
He did not invent it but he was very very selective in his choice of
"facts" and was very deceitful and creative in how he interpreted
them.
Post by Special Care
I take it you have not read in full any of his three principal books.
He foresaw that people would criticise his books without reading them.
I gave up after a few chapters. It is childish drivel. It is
misleading, dishonest and silly.
It works when you know nothing about what he is talking about. It all
sounds so clever and compelling If you just read in in your kitchen
and ignore what is actually known.

You keep repeatng this phrase of yours: "the universally accepted
geological record" like a mantra. This is another of your "facts"
that you chant until challened on it and then you say that this is a
distraction from the real deal. If these are universally accepted,
how come no geologists out there believe you or him? You really belive
it is a conspiracy to hide the truth?

The less you know about geology and astronomy, the more impressive
Velikovsky sounds. It is childish nonesense. You are very gullible.
Post by Special Care
He did not invent the universally accepted geological record as quoted
yawn (more of your silly verbiage)
Post by Special Care
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­------------------------------------
"Mass Scotoma Rides Again"http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_175d3cpt7cd
The Trilogy of Truth (Immanuel Velikovsky)http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_8d2hnhqgs
Old Jinglebollocks
2009-10-11 18:52:22 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 10, 3:10 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
You keep repeatng this phrase of yours: "the universally accepted
geological record" like a mantra.  This is another of your "facts"
that you chant until challened on it and then you say that this is a
distraction from the real deal.  If these are universally accepted,
how come no geologists out there believe you or him? You really belive
it is a conspiracy to hide the truth?
===

No, I said the vaccination debate is non-essential.

The undeniable geological record shows repeated destructions of the
surface of the globe within the past eleven thousand years, on such a
scale as to make vampirism and cannibalism the only means of survival
for some time.
And although the following is non-essential, it does seem clear that
the Christian communion ceremony is a forlorn *acting out* of that
ancient orgy of unrestrained vampirism and cannibalism. It makes no
sense otherwise, to go to church and fantasise every morning about
drinking the messiah's blood and eating his flesh to somehow gain
life.... the Christian communion ceremony is a legacy of our ancient
shame, one of our 'original sins.'
[The mother-infant relationship is the other major 'original sin.']

It's not so much a corrupt conspiracy by mainstream geologists. It's
just their collective, unspoken but agreed fear of seeing clearly the
scale of the destruction of the surface of the globe within recent
millennia, and the fear that it will be repeated.
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­------------------------------------
"Mass Scotoma Rides Again"
http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_175d3cpt7cd
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
The Trilogy of Truth (Immanuel Velikovsky)
http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_8d2hnhqgs- Hide quoted text -
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-11 20:13:34 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 11, 7:52 pm, Old Jinglebollocks
Post by Old Jinglebollocks
On Oct 10, 3:10 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
You keep repeatng this phrase of yours: "the universally accepted
geological record" like a mantra.  This is another of your "facts"
that you chant until challened on it and then you say that this is a
distraction from the real deal.  If these are universally accepted,
how come no geologists out there believe you or him? You really belive
it is a conspiracy to hide the truth?
===
No, I said the vaccination debate is non-essential.
The undeniable geological record shows repeated destructions of the
surface of the globe within the past eleven thousand years, on such a
scale as to make vampirism and cannibalism the only means of survival
for some time.
No it does not. This is silly and if I did want to find out what
happened, I would not ask a psychoanalyst. How come, when famines
happen (as they do regularly), vampirism and cannibalism are rare?

Velikovsky made all this shite up. It never happened.
Seth
2009-10-17 22:26:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Old Jinglebollocks
The undeniable geological record shows repeated destructions of the
surface of the globe within the past eleven thousand years,
I deny that the geological record shows any such thing.
Post by Old Jinglebollocks
on such a scale as to make vampirism and cannibalism the only means
of survival for some time.
Especially since those didn't happen on any global scale.
Post by Old Jinglebollocks
It's not so much a corrupt conspiracy by mainstream geologists. It's
just their collective, unspoken but agreed fear of seeing clearly the
scale of the destruction of the surface of the globe within recent
millennia, and the fear that it will be repeated.
More likely, it's their emphasis on truth and provability.

Seth
Special Care
2009-10-18 09:21:57 UTC
Permalink
New York judge says NO to forced vaccination
of health care workers.

Previously the State told health care workers if
they did not submit to the untested vaccine,
the would be fired.

First case in the US.

Video:

http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/717.html

- Brasscheck

P.S. Please share Brasscheck TV e-mails and
videos with friends and colleagues.

That's how we grow. Thanks.

==============================

Brasscheck TV
2380 California St.
San Francisco, CA 94115

--------------------------------

COMMENT:
It's more than what will happen in UK, in terms of self respect.
But why not go further than just waving placards?
We all have a legal right to defend ourselves from physical assault,
by reasonable force or citizens arrest.
Special Care
2009-10-18 10:17:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Seth
Post by Old Jinglebollocks
The undeniable geological record shows repeated destructions of the
surface of the globe within the past eleven thousand years,
I deny that the geological record shows any such thing.
Post by Old Jinglebollocks
on such a scale as to make vampirism and cannibalism the only means
of survival for some time.
Especially since those didn't happen on any global scale.
Post by Old Jinglebollocks
It's not so much a corrupt conspiracy by mainstream geologists. It's
just their collective, unspoken but agreed fear of seeing clearly the
scale of the destruction of the surface of the globe within recent
millennia, and the fear that it will be repeated.
More likely, it's their emphasis on truth and provability.
Seth
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I can draw your attention to the following again.
There's no use in saying it was 'written by Velikovsky' and then
making some cheap sneers at that man.
Velikovsky was quoting universally accepted sources:
http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_8d2hnhqgs

See especially the extracts from "Earth In Upheaval," quoted again
below as a study aid:
Best read in clearer type with images at that link, scrolling down
just over half way, but the text is given again here below -
http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_8d2hnhqgs

“Earth In Upheaval” is the second volume of what I sometimes call THE
TRILOGY OF TRUTH by Immanuel Velikovsky.

The reality of our lives, the truth about our history and the truth
about our emotional state - are so far removed from what the average
person believes, so far removed from the fake debates in the media and
from the fake debates in the universities - that it is very difficult
to mention anything truthful, anything realistic, to the average
person.

How can we convey the truth to human beings when their beliefs and
their assumptions are so far removed from reality. It’s too big a leap
for average people to make. You can’t mention the truth to average
people. If you do, they’ll soon make you regret it.

By the mid-1950s, Velikovsky understood well what he was up against,
and he stated in the preface to “Earth In Upheaval:”
------------------------------------------------------------------
“This book was not written for those who swear by the verba magistri -
the holiness of their school wisdom; and they may debate it without
reading it….”
------------------------------------------------------------------

“Earth In Upheaval” by Immanuel Velikovsky is there if you are ready
to face it. If you cannot obtain it anywhere else, I can send a full
photocopy of it to you on request at cost price, loose unbound pages,
not for resale but for study purposes among fellow students only.

To help you to come back into reality, I am reproducing below the
entire text of Chapter One of “Earth In Upheaval” by Dr Immanuel
Velikovsky, followed by the later section titled “The Hippopotamus.”

This is a uniquely shocking book, a book which reveals that the so-
called “science” of “geology” is only a farce, that “geology” is not
science at all but is only a pack of lies, just like the Vivisection
Swindle, a symptom of our collective mental illness of scotoma-
amnesia, a denial of what the surface of the earth is so clearly
revealing to us about our true history.

===================================
The following, then, is a mild ‘taster’ of “Earth In Upheaval” by
Immanuel Velikovsky.
===================================

Chapter 1 of “Earth In Upheaval” by Immanuel Velikovksy, reproduced
only as a study aid to be exchanged among students of Velikovsky on a
non-profit basis.

Begin transcript, page 3 / Earth In Upheaval by Immanuel Velikovsky:

IN THE NORTH

In Alaska

In Alaska, to the north of Mount McKinley, the tallest mountain in
North America, the Tanana River joins the Yukon. From the Tanana
Valley and the valleys of its tributaries gold is mined out of gravel
and “muck.” This muck is a frozen mass of animals and trees.

F. Rainey of the University of Alaska described the scene1:

“Wide cuts, often several miles in length and sometimes as much as 140
feet in depth, are now being sluiced out along stream valleys
tributary to the Tanana in the Fairbanks District. In order to reach
gold-bearing gravel beds an over-burden of frozen silt or “muck” is
removed with hydraulic giants. This “muck” contains enormous numbers
of frozen bones of extinct animals such as the mammoth, mastodon,
super-bison and horse.”2



These animals perished in rather recent times; present estimates place
their extinction at the end of the Ice Age or in early post-glacial
times. The soil of Alaska covered their bodies together with those of
animals of species still surviving.

Under what conditions did this great slaughter take place, in which
millions upon millions of animals were torn limb from limb and mingled
with uprooted trees?



-------------------------------------------------

Footnotes to page 3:

1 F. Rainey, “Archaeological Investigation in Central Alaska,”
‘American Antiquity,’ V (1940), 305.

2 The horse became extinct in pre-Columbian America; the present
horses in the Western Hemisphere are descendants of imported animals.

-------------------------------------------------



page 4 / Earth In Upheaval by Immanuel Velikovsky



F. C. Hibben of the University of New Mexico writes:

“Although the formation of the deposits of muck is not clear, there is
ample evidence that at least portions of this material were deposited
under catastrophic conditions. Mammal remains are for the most part
dismembered and disarticulated, even though some fragments yet retain,
in their frozen state, portions of ligaments, skin, hair, and flesh.
Twisted and torn trees are piled in splintered masses… At least four
considerable layers of volcanic ash may be traced in these deposits,
although they are extremely warped and distorted…”3



Could it be that a volcanic eruption killed the animal population of
Alaska, the streams carrying down into the valleys the bodies of the
slaughtered animals? A volcanic eruption would have charred the trees
but would not have uprooted and splintered them; if it killed animals,
it would not have dismembered them. The presence of volcanic ash
indicates that a volcanic eruption did take place, and repeatedly, in
four consecutive stages of the same epoch; but it is also apparent
that the trees could have been uprooted and splintered only by
hurricane or flood or a combination of both agencies. The animals
could have been dismembered only by a stupendous wave that lifted and
carried and smashed and tore and buried millions of bodies and
millions of trees. Also, the area of the catastrophe was much greater
than the action of a few volcanoes could have covered.



Muck deposits like those of the Tanana River Valley are found in the
lower reaches of the Yukon in the western part of the peninsula, on
the Koyukuk River that flows into the Yukon from the north, on the
Kuskokwim River that empties its waters into Bering Sea, and at
several places along the Arctic coast, and so “may be considered to
extend in greater or lesser thickness over all unglaciated areas of
the northern peninsula.”4



What could have caused the Arctic Sea and the Pacific Ocean to irrupt
and wash away forests with all their animal population and throw the
entire mingled mass in great heaps scattered all over Alaska, the
coast of which is longer than the Atlantic seaboard from Newfoundland
to Florida? Was it not a tectonic revolution in the earth’s crust,
that also caused the volcanoes to erupt and to cover the peninsula
with ashes?



-------------------------------------------------

Footnotes to page 4:

3 F. C. Hibben, “Evidence of Early Man in Alaska,” ‘American
Antiquity,’ VIII (1943), 256.

4 Ibid.

-------------------------------------------------



page 5 / Earth In Upheaval by Immanuel Velikovsky



In various levels of the muck, stone artefacts were found “frozen *in
situ* at great depths and in apparent association” with the Ice Age
fauna, which implies that “men were contemporary with the extinct
animals in Alaska.”5 Worked flints, characteristically shaped, called
Yuma points, were repeatedly found in the Alaskan muck, one hundred
and more feet below the surface. One such spear point was found there
between a lion’s jaw and a mammoth’s tusk.6 Similar weapons were used
only a few generations ago by the Indians of the Athapascan tribe, who
camped in the upper Tanana Valley.7 “It has also been suggested that
even modern Eskimo points are remarkably Yuma-like,”8 all of which
indicates that the multitudes of torn animals and splintered forests
date from a time not many thousands of years ago.





The Ivory Islands



The arctic coast of Siberia is cold, bleak, inhospitable. The sea is
passable for ships manoeuvring between floating ice for two months of
the year; from September to the middle of July the ocean north of
Siberia is fettered, an unbroken desert of ice. Polar winds sweep over
the frozen tundras of Siberia, where no tree grows and the soil is
never tilled. In his exploratory voyage on the ship Vega in 1878, Nils
Adolf Erik Nordenskjold, the first to traverse this northern seaway
from one end to the other, travelled for weeks along the coast from
Novaya Zemlya to Cape Shelagskoi (170° 30¢ east) on the eastern
extremity of Siberia without seeing a single human being on the
shore.



Fossil tusks of the mammoth – an extinct elephant – were found in
northern Siberia and brought southward to markets at a very early
time, possibly in the days of Pliny in the first century AD. The
Chinese excelled in working delicate designs in the ivory, much of
which they obtained from the north. And from the days of the conquest
of Siberia (1582) by the Cossack Yermak under Ivan the Terrible, until
our own times, trade in mammoths’ tusks has gone on. Northern Siberia
provided more than half the world’s supply of ivory, many piano keys
and many billiard balls being made from the fossil tusks of these
mammoths.



-------------------------------------------------

Footnotes to page 5:

5 Rainey, ‘American Antiquity,’ V, 307.

6 Hibben, ‘American Antiquity,’ VIII, 257.

7 Rainey, ‘American Antiquity,’ V, 301.

8 Hibben, ‘American Antiquity, VIII, 256.

-------------------------------------------------



page 6 / Earth In Upheaval by Immanuel Velikovsky



In 1797, the body of a mammoth, with flesh, skin, and hair, was found
in north-eastern Siberia, and since then bodies of other mammoths have
been unearthed from the frozen ground in various parts of that region.
The flesh had the appearance of freshly frozen beef; it was edible,
and wolves and sledge dogs fed on it without harm.1



The ground must have been frozen ever since the day of their
entombment; had it not been frozen, the bodies of the mammoths would
have putrified in a single summer, but they remained unspoiled for
some thousands of years. “It is therefore absolutely necessary to
believe that the bodies were frozen up immediately after the animals
died, and *were never once thawed* until the day of their
discovery.”2



High in the north above Siberia, six hundred miles inside the Polar
Circle, in the Arctic Ocean, lie the Liakhov Islands. Liakhov was a
hunter who, in the days of Catherine II, ventured to these islands and
brought back the report that they abounded in mammoths’ bones. “Such
was the enormous quantity of mammoths’ remains that it seemed… that
the island was actually composed of the bones and tusks of elephants,
cemented together by icy sand.”3



The New Siberian Islands, discovered in 1805 and 1806, as well as the
islands of Stolbovoi and Belkov to the west, present the same picture.
“The soil of these desolate islands is absolutely packed full of the
bones of elephants and rhinoceroses in astonishing numbers.”4 “These
islands were full of mammoth bones, and the quantity of tusks and
teeth of elephants and rhinoceroses found in the newly discovered
island of New Siberia was perfectly amazing, and surpassed anything
which had as yet been discovered.”5



-------------------------------------------------

Footnotes to page 6:

1 Observation of D. F. Hertz, in B. Digby, ‘The Mammoth’ (1926), p.
9.

2 D. Gath Whitley, “The Ivory Islands in the Arctic Ocean,” ‘Journal
of the Philosophical Society of Great Britain,’ XII (1910), 35.

3 Ibid., p. 41.

4 Ibid., p. 36.

5 Ibid., p. 42.

-------------------------------------------------



page 7 / Earth In Upheaval by Immanuel Velikovsky



Did the animals come there over the ice, and for what purpose? On what
food could they have lived? Not on the lichens of the Siberian
tundras, covered by deep snow most of the year, and still less on the
moss of the polar islands, which are frozen ten months in the year.
Mammoths, members of the voracious elephant family, required huge
quantities of vegetable food every day in they year. How could large
herds of them have existed in a country like north-east Siberia, which
is regarded as the coldest place in the world, and where there was no
food for them?



Mammoth tusks have been dredged in nets from the bottom of the Arctic
Ocean; and after arctic gales the shores of the islands are strewn
with tusks cast up by the billows. This is regarded as an indication
that the bottom of the Arctic Ocean between the islands and the
mainland was dry land in the days when mammoths roamed there.



Georges Cuvier, the great French palaeontologist (1769-1832), thought
that in a vast catastrophe of continental dimensions the sea
overwhelmed the land, the herds of mammoths perished, and in a second
spasmodic movement the sea rushed away, leaving the carcasses behind.
This catastrophe must have been accompanied by a precipitous drop in
temperature; the frost seized the dead bodies and saved them from
decomposition.6 In some mammoths, when discovered, the eyeballs were
still preserved.



Charles Darwin, who denied the occurrence of continental catastrophes
in the past, in a letter to Sir Henry Howorth, admitted that the
extinction of mammoths in Siberia was for him an insoluble problem.7
J. D. Dana, the leading American geologist of the second half of the
last century, wrote: “The encasing in ice of huge elephants, and the
perfect preservation of the flesh, shows that the cold finally became
*suddenly* extreme, as of a single winter’s night, and knew no
relenting afterward.”8



-------------------------------------------------

Footnotes to page 7:

6 Georges Cuvier, ‘Discours sur les revolutions de la surface du globe
et sur les changements qu’elles ont produits dans le regne
animal’ (1825).

7 Whitley, ‘Journal of the Philosophical Society of Great Britain,’
XII (1910), 56. G. F. Kunz, ‘Ivory and the Elephant’ (1916), p 236.

8 J. D. Dana, ‘Manual of Geology’ (4th ed.; 1894), p. 1007.

-------------------------------------------------



page 8 / Earth In Upheaval by Immanuel Velikovsky



In the stomachs and between the teeth of the mammoths were found
plants and grasses that do not grow now in northern Siberia. “The
contents of the stomachs have been carefully examined; they showed the
undigested food, leaves of trees now found in Southern Siberia, but a
long way from the existing deposits of ivory. Microscopic examination
of the skin showed red blood corpuscles, which was a proof not only of
a sudden death, but that the death was due to suffocation either by
gases or water, evidently the latter in this case. But the puzzle
remained to account for the sudden freezing up of this large mass of
flesh so as to preserve it for future ages.”9



What could have caused a sudden change in the temperature of the
region? Today the country does not provide food for large quadrupeds,
the soil is barren and produces only moss and fungi a few months in
the year; at that time the animals fed on plants. And not only
mammoths pastured in northern Siberia and on the islands of the Arctic
Ocean. On Kotelnoi Island “neither trees, nor shrubs, no bushes exist…
and yet the bones of elephants, rhinoceroses, buffaloes and horses are
found in this icy wilderness in numbers which defy all
calculation.”10





When Hedenstrom and Sannikov discovered the New Siberian Islands in
1806, they found in the “desolate wilderness” of polar sea the remains
of “enormous petrified forests.” These forests could be seen tens of
miles away. “The trunks of the trees in these ruins of ancient forests
were partly standing upright and partly lying horizontally buried in
the frozen soil. Their extent was very great.”11 Hedenstrom described
them as follows: “On the southern coast of New Siberia are found the
remarkable wood hills [piles of trunks]. They are 30 fathoms [180
feet] high, and consist of horizontal strata of sandstone, alternating
with strata of bituminous beams or trunks of trees. On ascending these
hills, fossilised charcoal is everywhere met with, covered apparently
with ashes; but, on closer examination, this ash is also found to be a
petrifaction, and so hard that it can scarcely be scraped off with a
knife.”12 Some trunks are fixed perpendicularly in the sandstone, with
broken ends.



-------------------------------------------------

Footnotes to page 8:

9 Whitley, ‘Journal of the Philosophical Society of Great Britain,’
XII(1910), 56.

10 Ibid., p. 50.

11 Ibid., p 43.

12 F. P. Wrangell, ‘Narrative of an Expedition to Siberia and the
Polar Sea,’ (1841), note to p. 173 of the American edition.

-------------------------------------------------





page 9 / Earth In Upheaval by Immanuel Velikovsky



In 1829 the German scientist G. A. Erman went to the Laikhov and the
New Siberian Islands to measure there the magnetic field of the earth.
He described the soil as full of the bones of elephants, rhinoceroses
and buffaloes. Of the piles of wood he wrote: “In New Siberia
[Island], on the declivities facing the south, lie hills 250 or 300
feet high, formed of driftwood, the ancient origin of which, as well
as of the fossil wood in the tundras, anterior to the history of the
Earth in its present state, strikes at once even the most uneducated
hunters… Other hills on the same island, and on Kotelnoi, which lies
further to the west, are heaped up to an equal height with skeletons
of pachyderms [elephants, rhinoceroses], bisons, etc., which are
cemented together by frozen sand as well as by strata and veins of
ice… On the summit of the hills they [the trunks of trees] lie flung
upon one another in the wildest disorder, forced upright in spite of
gravitation, and with their tops broken off or crushed, as if they had
been thrown with great violence from the south on a bank, and there
heaped up.”13



Eduard von Toll repeatedly visited the New Siberian Islands from 1885
to 1902, when he perished in the Arctic Ocean. He examined the “wood
hills” and “found them to consist of carbonised trunks of trees, with
impressions of leaves and fruits.”14 On Maloi, one of the group of
Liakhov Islands, Toll found bones of mammoths and other animals
together with the trunks of fossil trees, with leaves and cones. “This
striking discovery proves that in the days when the mammoths and
rhinoceroses lived in northern Siberia, these desolate islands were
covered with great forests, and bore a luxuriant vegetation.”15



A hurricane, apparently, uprooted the trees of Siberia and flung them
to the extreme north; mountainous waves of the ocean piled them in
huge hills and some agent of a bituminous nature transformed them into
charcoal, either before or after they were deposited and cemented in
drifted masses of sand that became baked into sandstone.



These petrified forests were swept from northern Siberia into the
ocean, and together with bones of animals and drifted sand built the
islands. It may be that not all the charred trees and the mammoths and
other animals were destroyed and swept away in a single catastrophe.
It is more probable that one huge cemetery of animals and trees came
flying through the air on the crest of a retreating tidal wave to
settle astride another, older cemetery, deep in the Polar Circle.



-------------------------------------------------

Footnotes to page 9:

13 G. A. Erman, ‘Travels in Siberia’ (1848), II, 376, 383.

14 Whitley, ‘Journal of the Philosophical Society of Great Britain,’
XII (1910), 49.

15 Ibid., p. 50.

-------------------------------------------------





page 10 / Earth In Upheaval by Immanuel Velikovsky



The scientists who explored the “muck” beds of Alaska have not
reflected upon the similarity in appearance of animal remains there
and in the polar regions of Siberia and on the arctic islands, and
have therefore not discussed a common cause. The exploration of the
New Siberian Islands, one thousand miles away from Alaska, was the
work of eighteenth- and nineteenth-century academicians who followed
the hunters of fossil ivory; the exploration of Alaskan soil was the
work of twentieth-century scientists who followed the gold-digging
machines.



These two observations – one old, one new – came from the north.
Before presenting many more from all parts of the world, I shall
review a few dominant theories on the history of our earth and its
animal kingdom. We shall read in brief, in the original statements of
the authors, how the earlier naturalists explained the phenomena; how,
subsequently, the same phenomena were interpreted in terms of slow
evolution; and how in the last fourscore years more and more facts
have presented themselves that do not square with the picture of a
peaceful world moulded in a slow and uneventful process.



-------------------------------------------------

End of Chapter 1 of “Earth In Upheaval” by Immanuel Velikovsky,
reproduced for study purposes only, to be shared among students of
Velikovsky on a non-profit basis.

-------------------------------------------------


THE HIPPOPOTAMUS

The hippopotamus inhabits the larger rivers and marshes of Africa. It
is not found in Europe or America save in zoological gardens where
specimens of it wallow most of the time in pools, submerging their
huge bodies in muddy water. Next to the elephant it is the largest of
the land animals. Bones of hippopotami are found in the soil of
Europe as far north as Yorkshire in England.



Lyell gave the following explanation for the presence of the
hippopotamus in Europe:



“The geologist …may freely speculate on the time when herds of
hippopotami issued from North African rivers, such as the Nile, and
swam northward in summer along the coasts of the Mediterranean, or
even occasionally visited islands near the shore. Here and there they
may have landed to graze or browse, tarrying awhile, and afterwards
continuing their course northward. Others may have swum in a few
summer days from rivers in the south of Spain or France to the Somme,
Thames or Severn, making timely retreat to the south before the snow
and ice set in.”



An Argonaut expedition of hippopotami from the rivers of Africa to the
isles of Albion sounds like an idyll.



In the Victorian cave near Settle, in West Yorkshire, 1,450 feet above
sea level, under twelve feet of clay deposit containing some well-
scratched boulders, were found numerous remains of the mammoth,
rhinoceros, hippopotamus, bison, hyena and other animals.



In northern Wales in the Vale of Clwyd, in numerous caves remains of
the hippopotamus lay together with those of the mammoth, the
rhinoceros and the cave lion. In the cave of Cae Gwyn in the Vale of
Clwyd, “during the excavations it became clear that the bones had been
greatly disturbed by water action.” The floor of the cavern was
“covered afterwards by clays and sand containing foreign pebbles.
This seemed to prove that the caverns, now 400 feet above sea level
must have been submerged subsequently to their occupation by the
animals and by man… The contents of the cavern must have been
dispersed by marine action during the great submergence in mid-glacial
times, and afterwards covered by marine sands…” writes H. B. Woodward.



Hippopotami not only travelled during the summer nights to England and
Wales, but also climbed hills to die peacefully among other animals in
the caves, and the ice, approaching softly, tenderly spread little
pebbles over the travellers resting in peace, and the land with its
hills and caverns in a slow lullaby movement sank below the level of
the sea and gentle streams caressed the dead bodies and covered them
with rosy sand.



Three assumptions were made by the exponents of uniformity: sometime
not long ago the climate of the British Isles was so warm that
hippopotami used to visit there in summer; the British Isles subsided
so much that caves in the hills became submerged; the land rose again
to its present height – and all this without any action of a violent
nature.



Or was it, perchance, a mountain-high wave that crossed the land and
poured into the caves and filled them with marine sand and gravel? Or
did the ground submerge and then emerge again in some paroxysm of
nature in which the climate also changed? Did the animals run away at
the sign of the approaching catastrophe, and did the trespassing sea
follow and suffocate them in the caves that were their last refuge and
became the place of their burial? Or did the sea sweep them from
Africa, throw them in heaps on the British Isles and in other places,
and cover them with earth and marine debris? The entrances to some
caves were too narrow and the caves themselves too “shrunk” to have
been places of refuge for such huge animals as hippopotami and
rhinoceroses. Whichever of these answers or surmises is correct, and
whether the hippopotami lived in England or were thrown there by the
ocean, whether they sought refuge in caves or the caves are but their
graves, their bones on the British Isles, as also on the bottom of the
seas surrounding these islands, are signs of some great natural
change.

“THE HIPPOPOTAMUS” - from “Earth in Upheaval” by Immanuel Velikovsky.

Reproduced with reasonably presumed permission as a study note for
fellow students of Velikovsky to illustrate the wealth of evidence
that catastrophes (=poleshifts =‘the end of the world’) have occurred
repeatedly within historical times.
http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dddp6bt4_8d2hnhqgs


===================================

===================================
Special Care
2009-10-18 16:43:45 UTC
Permalink
http://wcbstv.com/breakingnewsalerts/mandatory.h1n1.vaccine.2.1252672.html

Oct 16, 2009 3:13 pm US/Eastern

Judge Halts Flu Vaccine Mandate For Health Workers

New York Health Care Employees Won't Be Forced To Get H1N1
Vaccine...For Now

NEW YORK (CBS)
Poll: Third Of Parents Oppose H1N1 Vaccine
(10/8/2009)

Health care workers in New York will no longer be forced to get the
H1N1 swine flu vaccine, CBS 2 has learned.

A state Supreme Court judge issued a restraining order Friday against
the state from enforcing the controversial mandatory vaccination.

The order came as the Public Employees Federation sued to reverse a
policy requiring vaccination against the seasonal and swine flu
viruses, arguing that state Health Commissioner Richard Daines
overstepped his authority.

Three parties – the Public Employees Federaion, New York State United
Teachers, and an attorney representing four Albany nurses – challenged
the order and for now the vaccination for nurses, doctors, aides, and
non-medical staff members who might be in a patient's room will remain
voluntary.

The health department had said the workers must be vaccinated by
November 30 or face possible disciplinary action, including dismissal.
PEF said it encourages members to get flu vaccinations, but opposes
the emergency regulation requiring the vaccine as a condition of
employment.

A judge granted a temporary restraining order Friday morning, PEF
spokeswoman Debbie Miles said. A court hearing is scheduled for
October 30.

New York was the first state in the country to initially mandate flu
vaccinations for its health care workers, but many health care workers
quickly protested against the ruling. In Hauppauge, workers outside a
local clinic screamed "No forced shots!" when the mandate came down at
the end of September.

"I don't even tend to the sick. I am in the nutrition field. They are
telling me I must get the shot because I work in a health clinic
setting," said Paula Small, a Women, Infants and Children health care
worker.

Small said she would refuse to be vaccinate, worried the vaccine is
untested and unproven, leaving her vulnerable. In 1976, there were
some deaths associated with a swine flu vaccination.

Registered nurse Frank Mannino, 50, was also angry. He said the state
regulation violates his personal freedom and civil rights.

"And now I will lose my job if I don't take the regular flu shot or
the swine flu shot."

When asked if he's willing to lose his job, Mannino said, "Absolutely.
I will not take it, will not be forced. This is still America."

The protest also shook Albany. Hundreds of demonstrators demanded
freedom of choice. After all, as health care professionals, they argue
they're already constantly washing their hands and aren't likely to
transmit or contract the flu.

Around 500,000 health care workers would have been slated to receive
the vaccine

"It's certainly their prerogative to voice their opinion," said Dr.
Susan Donelan of Stony Brook University Hospital.

Donelan said most in the medical community see the benefits and safety
of the shots and welcome them, and that hospitals must obey the law.

"Our hospital is committed to following the mandate to have our
personnel vaccinated," she said.

The state said change was needed this year to save lives. Typically
only about 45 percent of health care workers take advantage of
voluntary flu vaccines.

More than 150 institutional outbreaks of seasonal and H1N1 flu are
expected this year in hospitals, nursing homes and hospice centers.

There is also a strong resistance to the vaccine from the general
public. A new Harvard University poll shows that only four in 10
adults intend to take the vaccine themselves, and only six in 10 plan
to give it to their children.
Special Care
2009-10-21 12:11:16 UTC
Permalink
====================================
The Chip is at the Tip of the Needle

HOLLY NOTE: This article is rife with "loaded language". Sort out the
value nuggets from the hype.

By Dr Ryke Geerd Hamer (New GermanMedicine)

Yesterday, 27 August 2009, I was giving an introductory talk about
German New Medicine (GNM) near Vienna, Austria. My wife was with me
and about 40 listeners. At the end as part of the discussion the swine
flu was mentioned and a lady got up and declared the following:

A friend of hers works for a pharmaceutical company in Vienna and told
her that the swine flu injection needles indeed contain nano particles
in their very tip, which cannot be detected with the naked eye but are
clearly visible with as little as a 12 times magnifying microscope
like children’s toy microscopes. The staff of the pharmaceutical
company was advised that these nano particles work in the human body
like a motherboard in the computer and lots of data can be stored on
it, which will make cash cards obsolete. This measure was also
intended to do an accurate census and to protect babies, as many
mothers would simply "discard" their newborn, without knowledge of the
authorities.

This lady further disclosed that she was working in the medical field.
She had asked a lawyer who came to her as a patient, how it was
possible to avoid being chipped. He told her that he was aware of the
planned chipping of the population; in fact most upper class members
of society were aware of this plan. For this year no forced
vaccinations were planned but to rather encourage people through the
media to volunteer for the jab.

In case too few would come forward, forced vaccination was planned for
next year. Exempt from those were certain professional groups like the
police, medical personal, politicians etc. Being a lawyer, he knew
ways for himself to avoid the jab, but for the majority of the
population there was no escape.

Interview with Dr Gert Hamer (GNM) by Helmut Pilhar (Engineer) ,

Wednesday, 26. August 2009

Hamer: Within a few days our worst fears were indeed superseded by
this cruel reality.

Pilhar: Geerd, are you talking about the $1000 fine and 30 day arrest
threats for refusal to take the vaccination in the US?

Hamer: Yes, but the objectors (death chip opposers are traitors) are
not going to be put into normal prisons but in especially prepared
concentration camps of which hundreds have been prepared all over the
country. And you can leave those only by getting chipped. And once you
are outside it is open season through the death chip. By chance these
people are then going to drop dead like flies after their release.

Pilhar: Are you talking about the beginning of the great population
cull?

Hamer: It can only mean that. Otherwise it does not make any sense to
get the military and the police involved, threaten with such draconian
penalties, all just to get the people to participate in a simple
seasonal flu shot campaign. It just does not make any other sense.
Apart from the fact that there cannot even be a vaccination like that.
You vaccinate in October (northern autumn) for the next summer. That
is totally laughable. With Tamiflu you can maybe suppress typical
healing phase symptoms for 2-3 weeks and even that is totally
brainless in the light of GNM.

Pilhar: It is noteworthy that in the US there are literally many
500,000 plastic coffins stock piled. What for? And apart from that the
population has been systematically stripped of weapons and protective
dogs.

Hamer: You can best understand what the intent is by what is NOT
talked about. One may talk about the vaccination, but nobody mentions
the chip implanting by name. That is really strange because the
chipping is the obvious issue in the face of these massive
governmental measures. And that the Hitachi chip works and can be
combined with the death chip we already talked about during the last
interview.

The same can be seen in how my GNM (German New Medicine) fared. For 28
years one was only allowed to discuss Hamer, the "Unperson", but not
whether GNM actually works and whether its claims are repeatable, and
can be proven to work, in spite of 30 verified published results. The
same applies to Tamuflu! There are endless discussions about Tamiflu
causing harm but none about the chip. Of course Tamiflu is harmful, it
is a poison. It is also very damaging in the healing process or in the
vagotonic phase of a pregnancy (last trimester). But the death chip
adds a whole new dimension. That this death chip is going to be used
without concern can be seen in the fact that chemo and morphine have
been used without concern in spite of final mortality rates of 98%,
while 98% could have survived with GNM. Imagine the unscrupulousness
of all oncologists, as they are fully aware that GNM adds up from a
scientific perspective and works

Pilhar: It is also very strange that the Americans have created this
Marshall Law, under which critics can be easily removed by the
thousands and millions. And once you have chipped the people they
cannot run away from you anymore.

Hamer: It is obvious that this chip battle has been under preparation
for many years. The idiotic swine flu, that does not even really
exist, was actually the wrong tool: 3 dead pigs and one child, dead
from who knows what, with that they lied and constructed a worldwide
pandemic into existence. But it goes to show what a well organised
world press is able to achieve: They can turn a mole hill into a
mountain.

Pilhar: It started with the AIDS lie, then followed the BSE lie. After
the 9/11 lie followed the Anthrax lie. Then it was the Bird Flu lie,
now it is the Swine Flu lie. Next year we’ll have the Mice Flu lie. It
all points to the "Endloesung", the final solution. When everybody has
a chip then that will constitute the complete slavery, then everybody
can be manipulated and assassinated arbitrarily.

Hamer: First they jump on the babies and the pregnant women. They are
first to be treated with chips and Tamiflu. Many of the pregnant women
in their last trimester are going to lose their babies, because
Tamiflu is totally toxic. But also the women themselves can die, as
their bodies are vagotonic during the last trimester. It is a known
fact that during vagotonia one flu shot or one morphine injection can
be deadly.

In the meantime there seems to be some panic in the US. Where in the
world can you flee to, people are asking themselves, where will you
not be forcibly injected with the death chip and have one free moment
away from your enemies?

One has to consider realistically what it would be like to carry this
death chip and know that any day you can simply be switched off by the
Centre in Tel Aviv. You are completely defenceless against that and
complaining won’t do you any good: "If I only had known..." Therefore
it is really important for the ruling class to keep the people in the
dark about it as long as possible.

Once the slaves have the death chip implanted they are allowed to know
about it. Then they will be like trained poodles. Nobody will dare to
speak up. It will be like among the Masonic brethren. Everybody knows
that the moment he utters a word of dissent, he will be served poison
in the coffee by the always Jewish Grand Master and won’t survive
another day. The whole world is going to be a concentration camp full
of slaves, except for the members of one religious group. To have the
death chip implanted is the potential personal death sentence at any
given time.

How naive do you have to be to demand of Mossad and the CIA to
disclose what their real intentions are, "to table the facts"? The
mouse never believes the cat will come.

In a company with several hundred staff, which produces, or better
fills the injection needles for the chip vaccination, it will only
need one or two "reliable" people to insert the chip at the end. Then
all the other workers can confirm that they knew nothing. This is
called "quality control" and "final check" and appears completely
normal.

Strange is too that every single chip vaccination needle has its own
individual code number, which is added to the ID number. Why else
would the silly "summer flu shot" needle have its own individual
number and why should the passport accompany the supposed flu
vaccination? And why do the Americans not want to let anybody into the
country who does not have a chip?

Pilhar: The "Club of Rome" declared in the 70s in one of their
publications (possibly in Mankind at the Turning Point ) in effect
that either the birth rate would have to be reduced or the death rate
increased. The Max Planck Institute believes that the world population
must be reduced to 2 billion people. In the US there is the so called
"American Stonehenge", a message engraved in 100 ton granite blocks,
that the world population has to be reduced to 500 million people, to
reach an "Era of Reason".

When you look at the supposed issue of "overpopulation" it is
interesting to note that apparently the State of Texas alone could
feed all 6 billion people. If one piled those 6 billion bodies with an
average weight of 80kg and a volume of 80 liters on top and side by
side of each other in a cube shape, the sides of this cube would be
only 800 meters long. In Austria we could hide such a cube in the next
valley.

I don’t believe in the so called "overpopulation" but rather suppose
that the globalisation fanatics don’t need 6 billion work slaves and
therefore want to reduce the population to one tenth.

Hamer: Helmut, you were right when you said during our last interview
on 13 August 2009: "Once they have accomplished that, they have won."
Therefore the German New Medicine had to be suppressed, because if
this awareness and knowledge had been common place they could not have
done it. "Lewwer duad üs Slaav!" Rather dead than slave! (from Pidder
Lueng, by Detler von Liliencron).

Cheers to the GNM, the New Biological Medicine and a world view of
freedom and truth for us all.

Dr. Ryke Geerd Hamer
Ing. Helmut Pilhar

The original was in German and has been translated.
Here is the original link: http://welt-blog.ch/chip-sitzt-in-der-spritzen-spitze/
Special Care
2009-10-21 14:08:26 UTC
Permalink
Dr. Mercola's Comments:

The vaccine market is booming right now. Already, drug companies have
sold $1.5 billion worth of swine flu shots, in addition to the $1
billion for seasonal flu they booked earlier this year. In addition to
that, Congress has set aside more than $10 billion this year to
research flu viruses, monitor H1N1's progress and educate the public
about prevention.

But there is still some good news in the midst of all this, and that
is that more people than ever before are finally beginning to sit up
and take notice, and are beginning to consider the risks versus
benefits of flu vaccinations.

As I recently reported, a new poll by Consumer Reports shows that
nearly 2/3 of American parents plan to either hold off on vaccinating
their children against the H1N1 (swine flu) virus, or won't vaccinate
them at all.

In fact, quite a number of surveys, polls and studies are showing that
more and more people are refusing the swine flu shot for themselves or
their children over health and safety concerns.

And even a recent New York Times article acknowledges this site as
playing an important role in educating the public about vaccine safety
concerns, which has contributed to a less than wholehearted embrace of
the government’s recommendation to rush out and get vaccinated.

The NY Times reports that, "The popular Web site Mercola.com is urging
parents not to get the flu vaccine ...", with the result that the
majority of parents are now planning to refuse to let their children
get these shots.

Largely as a result of this Web site's posting the information, and
your sharing it with your friends and relatives, we have together
created MAJOR doubt in the minds of many consumers about the value of
these vaccinations. Many people are now coming to the realization that
flu vaccinations can cause serious health problems.

Together, we are making a difference! A difference that is likely
saving people’s lives and preventing permanent and irreversible health
consequences.

Have You Thought About This?

Barbara Loe Fisher with the National Vaccine Information Center brings
up several important points to consider in her blog, Vaccine
Awakening. I highly recommend you read her article in its entirety,
but here are a few of the highlights:

•Getting vaccinated in a non-medical setting can be very dangerous.

The swine flu vaccine is now being offered all over the place; in
pharmacies, stores, schools, and even drive-by kiosks. Getting
vaccinated in a non-medical setting like this can be very risky. For
example, if you drive away immediately after getting vaccinated and
suffer an unexpected allergic reaction or collapse, it could be
deadly, not only for you but also for innocent bystanders and others
sharing the road with you.

These places also do not have the ability to properly evaluate your
medical history, nor perform the necessary follow-up, should you have
any adverse reactions.

•If you get vaccinated and suffer health complications, REPORT IT!

This is a crucial element of vaccine safety, and diligent reporting of
all adverse reactions can help save the lives of others. As Fisher
recommends, insist that the health care worker who gave you the
vaccine immediately files a report with the US federal Vaccine Adverse
Event Reporting System (VAERS). If they, for whatever reason, won’t do
it, you CAN file it yourself!

To file a report yourself, simply go to www.vaers.hhs.gov and follow
the instructions.

•Don’t accept “coincidences” when it comes to vaccine reactions.

I strongly agree with her concern when she says:

“Do NOT let a doctor or anyone else tell you that a serious health
problem you or your child experiences after vaccination is a
coincidence and allow more shots to be given until you know for sure.

The most tragic cases of vaccine injury occur when vaccine reaction
symptoms are dismissed as a 'coincidence" and more vaccines are given
that result in more severe symptoms and sometimes end with permanent
brain and immune system damage or death.”
•There is NO safety data or precedent for receiving 3-4 flu shots in
one season.

Even though the media and government pronouncements sound confident
and authoritative it’s vital to realize that the current
recommendations by doctors and health officials are unprecedented, and
highly experimental.

Some people, including children under the age of 10, are urged to get
as many as four flu shots this year: two shots for seasonal flu and
one or two more for swine flu, depending on a few different factors.

Never before have this many flu shots been given in a single season,
and there is absolutely no information about the safety of doing so.

•Standing up for health care workers’ right to choose could save you
from mandatory vaccination down the line.

As of right now, the swine flu vaccination program is still voluntary
– unless you’re a health care worker that is… New York and other
states have already implemented laws that force their health care
workers to get the swine flu vaccine in order to work.

According to a recent report in Time Magazine, this includes not just
NY doctors and nurses who care for patients, but also administrative
staff, including housekeeping and food-service personnel.

What does that tell you about the possibility of mandatory
vaccinations for the rest of us?

Anti-Virals Now Pose Serious Health Threat from Environmental Sources
Too

According to a Japanese study published in the September 28 issue of
Environmental Health Perspectives, the flu drug Tamiflu is now
contaminating rivers downstream of sewage-treatment facilities.

The source? Urinary excretion from people taking Tamiflu (oseltamivir
phosphate).

Researchers are quite concerned that birds exposed to these waterborne
residues could develop and spread drug-resistant strains of various
types of flu.

Science News reports:

“Once ingested, virtually all Tamiflu will end up in the environment
in the active form, notes environmental chemist Jerker Fick of Umeå
University in Sweden. The reason: Tamiflu becomes active once the body
converts it into a carboxylate form.

Roughly 80 percent of an ingested dose becomes this OC, which your
body eventually excretes. Your body sheds the remaining 20 percent of
Tamiflu in its original form, but this phosphate form is immediately
turned into the active, carboxylate form when it reaches a water
treatment plant, he says.”

Making matters worse, previous studies have confirmed that water
treatment removes ZERO percent of this drug, and appears to have a
half-life of approximately three weeks, once exposed to sunlight.

I bring this up to demonstrate the long-term dangers inherent in our
current drug-based paradigm.

Each time you take a drug like Tamiflu, you not only expose yourself
to potentially serious health risks, you’re also contributing to a
growing problem of ever more drug-resistant flu strains that can
affect countless others. The willy-nilly administering of anti-virals
goes far beyond just the immediate health risks – it affects the
environment and every living thing in it, including the human race at
the top of the food chain.

The fact remains that there are many FAR BETTER alternatives to anti-
viral drugs and vaccines. These drugs are not essential for human
health – nutritious food, clean water, and an overall healthy
lifestyle are.

I’ve listed my top recommendations for avoiding the flu on many
occasions. For a refresher, you can find that list here.

In addition, should you be forced to take the swine flu shot, please
review Dr. Blaylock’s recommendations on what to do in that situation.

The Time to Act is Now

I urge you to join NVIC and become a grassroots vaccine safety and
informed consent advocate in your community.

“Stand up for the human right to make informed, voluntary health care
choices, including vaccine choices, today - so your children and
grandchildren and all Americans will have that right tomorrow.”
Barbara Loe Fisher

If, like NVIC says, we don’t stand up for our rights to choose now,
there is no doubt in my mind we’ll all be paying for it, both
financially and physically, in the years to come.
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/current.aspx
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-21 16:21:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
====================================
The Chip is at the Tip of the Needle
HOLLY NOTE: This article is rife with "loaded language". Sort out the
value nuggets from the hype.
By Dr Ryke Geerd Hamer (New GermanMedicine)
Yesterday, 27 August 2009, I was giving an introductory talk about
German New Medicine (GNM) near Vienna, Austria. My wife was with me
and about 40 listeners. At the end as part of the discussion the swine
SNIP
You have now gone too far and revealed information that you were not
supposed to even know about.
I now have no option but to have nano particles inserted into your
drinking water and special sampling devices attached to your sewage
outlets. We are now watching you. That dog that followed you half
way up your road two days ago had one false eye with a high resolution
MSCAT Hyperthermoggler installed instead which has given us a full
scale 3 D model of you. We will raise this at the next monthly
meeting of our Ruling Group sub-committee which meets on Fridays in
the local pub.
Special Care
2009-10-23 11:56:19 UTC
Permalink
Irish No Vote Fighting Back Against The Corrupt Officials
Can anyone help with the legal references?

Criminal Complaint against The Referendum Commission, Returning
Officers, José Manuel Barroso, The European Commission, Brian Cowen
and subsequent persons involved in the Lisbon Treaty Campaign.

The facts outlined below will prove that the Lisbon Treaty Referendum
of 2/10/09 is Null and Void under Irish and European law. I present
two separate points that shall subsequently be proven:

1) The Irish Government, alongside the European Commission ran a
fraudulent and illegal campaign for the Lisbon Treaty Referendum.

2) Numerous violations of Irish Referendum law and discrepancies
that call into question the security and validity of the votes
themselves, default the Irish vote to the result of the last
Referendum on the Lisbon Treaty.

3) The intervention of the European Commission, entailing massive
expenditure of money to influence Irish opinion towards a Yes, the
running of a web-site and the issuing of statements that sought to
counter No-side arguments, and the advocacy of a Yes vote by
Commission President Barroso and other Commissioners and their staffs
during visits to Ireland. This is unlawful under European law, as the
Commission has no function in relation to the ratification of new
Treaties, something that is exclusively a matter for the Member States
under their own constitutional procedures;

4) The part funding of the posters and press advertising of most
of Ireland’s Yes-side political parties by their sister parties in the
European Parliament, even though it is illegal under Irish law to
receive donations from sources outside the country in a referendum and
even though, under European law, money provided by the European
Parliament to cross-national political parties is supposed to be
confined to informational-type material and to avoid partisan
advocacy;

5) The Irish Government’s unlawful use of public funds in
circulating to voters a postcard with details of the so-called
“assurances” of the European Council, followed by a brochure some time
later containing a tendentious summary of the provisions of the Lisbon
Treaty, as well as other material - steps that were in breach of the
1995 Irish Supreme Court judgment in McKenna that it is
unconstitutional of the Government to use public funds to seek to
obtain a particular result in a referendum;

6) The failure of the country’s statutory Referendum Commission
to carry out its function under the Referendum Act that established it
of explaining to citizens how the proposed constitutional amendment
and its text would affect the Irish Constitution. Instead the
Commission’s Chairman, Judge Frank Clarke, turned the Commission into
an arm of Government propaganda, while the judge indulged himself in
various “solo-runs” on radio and in the newspapers, giving several
erroneous explanations of provisions of the Lisbon Treaty, even though
this was quite beyond his powers under the Act;

7) Huge expenditure of money by private companies such as Intel
and Ryanair to advocate a Yes vote, without any statutory limit, in
possible breach of Irish company and tax law, and undoubtedly
constituting a major democratic abuse.

8) Breaches by the Irish broadcast media of their obligation
under the Broadcasting Acts to be fair to all interests concerned in
their coverage of issues of public controversy and debate. Newstalk
106, owned by Mr Denis O’Brien, a committed supporter of the Yes side,
was quite shameless in its partisanship on its current affairs
programmes.

.... petition online containing this information:
http://www.gopetition.com/online/31224.html

•Under Irish law, ballot boxes are required to be delivered by members
of the Gardai to the polling stations at 7:00 am on the date the
election takes place.

•This legal requirement applies to ALL polling in Ireland, whether
elections or referendums.

•On this occasion, however, the ballot boxes were delivered to the
private residences of the polling/Returning Officers, 48 hours prior
to the Referendum.

•A number of honest Returning Officers formally objected to this
BREACH OF PROCEDURE, and to the concomitant prospective breach of
security, let alone of the electoral legislation.

•We understand that such objections were officially dismissed out of
hand on the spurious and diversionary grounds that the ballot boxes
possessed no commercial value, so it would be in nobody’s commercial
interest to steal them.

•The central issue – that since the Irish ballot boxes were delivered
48 hours early they could be ‘stuffed’ with YES votes by returning
officers, as routinely happens in places like the former Soviet
Republic of Georgia – was of course not addressed.

•The Irish voters were given pencils to make their mark on the ballot,
even though all Irish electoral ballots are supposed to be filled with
black pen.

•Almost nobody was asked for any form of ID or information at the
polling stations.

•The ballot boxes were left unattended and moved about by many people
without question.

•At least one box in Cork was removed from the count centre by an
unknown individual as shown in the attached picture and video link.

•Many foreign nationals and others who were not legally entitled to
vote voted in this Referendum. Irish Times article “Gardai to
investigate suspected vote fraud”, shows seven voters registered to an
empty house.
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/gardai-to-investigate-suspected-vote-fraud-1803847.html

•It follows that, given that the local electoral law was flouted, the
outcome of the Irish referendum is fraudulent and must immediately be
declared null and void.

Video here: Irish Referendum Count at Cork City
Hall


References:

http://www.nationalplatform.org/

http://www.indymedia.ie/article/94119

http://www.dublincity.ie/YourCouncil/LocalElections2009/Documents/LocalElectionsRegulations1995consolidatedFeb09.pdf
- Local Elections Regulations 1995 -2009

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/plweb-cgi/fastweb?state_id=1254787096&view=ag-view&numhitsfound=7&query_rule=%28%28$query3%29%29%3Alegtitle&query3=Electoral%20Act,%201992&docid=48488&docdb=Acts&dbname=Acts&dbname=SIs&sorting=none&operator=and&TemplateName=predoc.tmpl&setCookie=1
- Irish Electoral Act 1992

http://www.worldreports.org/news/235_the_irish_referendum_outcome_is_null_and_void
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[This post supplied by:
"Badfully Wrong" <***@distributions.badfullywrong.org.uk> ]

Seth
2009-10-11 05:32:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
Post by Seth
Post by Special Care
What prompted the orginal post above was the news from Massachusetts
that a law has already been passed there to make non-compliance with
vaccine rules punishable with thirty days in jail and fines that will
If the law was actually passed, you'd be able to provide a URL
pointing to a government web site with information about laws, rather
than a domain created a few months ago with a freemail account as the
contact.
I didn't look for such a URL because this is not my emphasis.
You posted it for some reason, didn't you? I take it that it doesn't
matter to you whether or not what you post is actually true.
Post by Special Care
The purpose was to prompt people to be wary about what they allow to
be injected into their bodies,
Falsely claiming that something is a law doesn't encourage people to
be wary about what they allow to be injected into their bodies, it
encourages them to be wary about what they see claimed on the net.
Post by Special Care
and also to show
The only thing it shows is that some people lie, and others point to
their websites anyway.
Post by Special Care
how the ruling group
"test the temperature" to see how far they can go in ratcheting up the
reversion to full-scale dictatorship.
What does "the ruling group" have to do with a bogus website that
makes false claims about a law?

Seth
Old Jinglebollocks
2009-10-11 18:20:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
how the ruling group
"test the temperature" to see how far they can go in ratcheting up the
reversion tofull-scaledictatorship.
What does "the ruling group" have to  do with a bogus website that
makes false claims about a law?
Seth
=======================

It appears that the bill has been passed by the Senate of
Massechusetts but not by the "House" which I expect means House of
Representatives at State level
[the usual non-job creation scheme, like the EU]....
.....therefore it was not passed into effective law at the time that
video was made.

If that's a fake website, we would have to ask why anyone would go to
such trouble to create such an elaborate and expensive hoax.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-11 20:10:44 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 11, 7:20 pm, Old Jinglebollocks
Post by Special Care
Post by Special Care
how the ruling group
"test the temperature" to see how far they can go in ratcheting up the
reversion tofull-scaledictatorship.
What does "the ruling group" have to  do with a bogus website that
makes false claims about a law?
Seth
=======================
It appears that the bill has been passed by the Senate of
Massechusetts but not by the "House" which I expect means House of
Representatives at State level
[the usual non-job creation scheme, like the EU]....
.....therefore it was not passed into effective law at the time that
video was made.
If that's a fake website, we would have to ask why anyone would go to
such trouble to create such an elaborate and expensive hoax.
What trouble? what expense? Whay have you spent the past x years
(god knows how many) writing all you have written? It costs almost
nothing to make a web site.
Reasons:
Paranoia?
Looking for attention?
Mischief?
Ignorance?

You really belive this is true? FFS
You are gullible.
Special Care
2009-10-11 20:44:10 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 11, 9:10 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Old Jinglebollocks
If that's a fake website, we would have to ask why anyone would go to
such trouble to create such an elaborate and expensive hoax.
What trouble?  what expense?  Whay have you spent the past x years
(god knows how many) writing all you have written?  It costs almost
nothing to make a web site.
Paranoia?
Looking for attention?
Mischief?
Ignorance?
You really belive this is true?  FFS
You are gullible.
------------------------------------


This is non-essential, but if that video at the above link is a hoax,
it is difficult to know why anyone would produce it at such great
effort and expense, when it could easily be disproved by just making
contact with someone on the ground in Boston. We still have that much
freedom.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-11 22:23:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Oct 11, 9:10 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Old Jinglebollocks
If that's a fake website, we would have to ask why anyone would go to
such trouble to create such an elaborate and expensive hoax.
What trouble?  what expense?  Whay have you spent the past x years
(god knows how many) writing all you have written?  It costs almost
nothing to make a web site.
Paranoia?
Looking for attention?
Mischief?
Ignorance?
You really belive this is true?  FFS
You are gullible.
------------------------------------
http://youtu.be/2_oD55WvDmM
This is non-essential, but if that video at the above link is a hoax,
it is difficult to know why anyone would produce it at such great
effort and expense, when it could easily be disproved by just making
contact with someone on the ground in Boston. We still have that much
freedom.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
That video you just linked to is not a hoax. What is a hoax is the
distortion that is used in the title of the video and in what you have
said and in what the web site said where it was implied that there was
a 1000 dollar fine for refusing the vaccine. That is a lie. It is a
fine if you break quarrantine. No one can be forced to be
vaccinated. You are either slow to understand plain English or are
just hearing what you want to hear.
Special Care
2009-10-12 21:10:21 UTC
Permalink
NaturalNews.com printable article
Originally published July 28 2009
Ten Things You're Not Supposed to Know about the Swine Flu Vaccine
by Mike Adams, the Health Ranger, NaturalNews Editor

(NaturalNews) She was deathly afraid of the flu.
So she asked her doc what she should do.
He jabbed her unseen
With a swine flu vaccine
Blurting, "Darling, I haven't a clue."
- by the Health Ranger

Let's not beat around the bush on this issue: The swine flu vaccines
now being prepared for mass injection into infants, children, teens
and adults have never been tested and won't be tested before the
injections begin. In Europe, where flu vaccines are typically tested
on hundreds (or thousands) of people before being unleashed on the
masses, the European Medicines Agency is allowing companies to skip
the testing process entirely.

And yet, amazingly, people are lining up to take the vaccine, absent
any safety testing whatsoever. When the National Institutes of Health
in the U.S. announced a swine flu vaccine trial beginning in early
August, it was inundated with phone calls and emails from people
desperate to play the role of human guinea pigs. The power of fear to
herd sheeple into vaccine injections is simply amazing...

Back in Europe, of course, everybody gets to be a guinea pig since no
testing will be done on the vaccine at all. Even worse, the European
vaccines will be using adjuvants -- chemicals used to multiply the
potency of the active ingredients in vaccines.

Notably, there is absolutely no safety data on the use of adjuvants in
infants and expectant mothers -- the two groups being most
aggressively targeted by the swine flu vaccine pushers. The leads us
to the disturbing conclusion that the swine flu vaccine could be a
modern medical disaster. It's untested and un-tried. Its ingredients
are potentially quite dangerous, and the adjuvants being used in the
European vaccines are suspected of causing neurological disorders.


Paralyzed by vaccines
I probably don't need to remind you that in 1976, a failed swine flu
vaccine caused irreparable damage to the nervous systems of hundreds
of people, paralyzing many. Medical doctors gave the problem a name,
of course, to make it sound like they knew what they were talking
about: Guillain-Barre syndrome. (Notably, they never called it "Toxic
Vaccine Syndrome" because that would be too informative.)

But the fact remains that doctors never knew how the vaccines caused
these severe problems, and if the same event played out today, all the
doctors and vaccine pushers would undoubtedly deny any link between
the vaccines and paralysis altogether. (That's what's happening today
with the debate over vaccines and autism: Complete denial.)

In fact, there are a whole lot of things you'll never be told by
health authorities about the upcoming swine flu vaccine. For your
amusement, I've written down the ten most obvious ones and published
them below.


Ten things you're not supposed to know about the swine flu vaccine
(At least, not by anyone in authority...)

#1 - The vaccine production was "rushed" and the vaccine has never
been tested on humans. Do you like to play guinea pig for Big Pharma?
If so, line up for your swine flu vaccine this fall...

#2 - Swine flu vaccines contain dangerous adjuvants that cause an
inflammatory response in the body. This is why they are suspected of
causing autism and other neurological disorders.

#3 - The swine flu vaccine could actually increase your risk of death
from swine flu by altering (or suppressing) your immune system
response. There is zero evidence that even seasonal flu shots offer
any meaningful protection for people who take the jabs. Vaccines are
the snake oil of modern medicine.

#4 - Doctors still don't know why the 1976 swine flu vaccines
paralyzed so many people. And that means they really have no clue
whether the upcoming vaccine might cause the same devastating side
effects. (And they're not testing it, either...)

#5 - Even if the swine flu vaccine kills you, the drug companies
aren't responsible. The U.S. government has granted drug companies
complete immunity against vaccine product liability. Thanks to that
blanket immunity, drug companies have no incentive to make safe
vaccines, because they only get paid based on quantity, not safety
(zero liability).

#6 - No swine flu vaccine works as well as vitamin D to protect you
from influenza. That's an inconvenient scientific fact that the U.S.
government, the FDA and Big Pharma hope the people never realize.

#7 - Even if the swine flu vaccine actually works, mathematically
speaking if everyone else around you gets the vaccine, you don't need
one! (Because it can't spread through the population you hang with.)
So even if you believe in the vaccine, all you need to do is encourage
your friends to go get vaccinated...

#8 - Drug companies are making billions of dollars from the production
of swine flu vaccines. That money comes out of your pocket -- even if
you don't get the jab -- because it's all paid by the taxpayers.

#9 - When people start dying in larger numbers from the swine flu,
rest assured that many of them will be the very people who got the
swine flu vaccine. Doctors will explain this away with their typical
Big Pharma logic: "The number saved is far greater than the number
lost." Of course, the number "saved" is entirely fictional...
imaginary... and exists only in their own warped heads.

#10 - The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the
world in the coming months aren't completely useless: They will
provide an easy way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
(Too bad there isn't some sort of blue dye that we could tag 'em with
for future reference...)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.

The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
Special Care
2009-10-12 21:11:42 UTC
Permalink
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.


The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an
easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-12 22:01:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
etc.
I take it this is what you consider to be mature, grown up
discussion.
Yawn, you are better when you talk about arses. At least you seem to
know something about them.
Westprog
2009-10-13 09:25:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
etc.
I take it this is what you consider to be mature, grown up
discussion.
Yawn, you are better when you talk about arses. At least you seem to
know something about them.
He is right though. It will be possible to spot the stupid people when the
vaccines are on offer.
--
J/

SOTW: "April Skies" - Jesus And Mary Chain

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x6ndu_jesus-mary-chain-april-skies_music
Special Care
2009-10-15 21:55:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Westprog
He is right though. It will be possible to spot the stupid people when the
vaccines are on offer.
------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/14/health/policy/14vaccine.html

Mandatory Flu Vaccination for N.Y. Health Workers Is Criticized

Published: October 13, 2009

The New York Civil Liberties Union demanded on Tuesday that the state
health commissioner withdraw a new regulation requiring hundreds of
thousands of health care workers to get both seasonal and swine flu
vaccinations.

In testimony before several State Assembly committees in Lower
Manhattan, Donna Lieberman, executive director of the civil liberties
union, said that the requirement violated the constitutional right of
health care workers to control their bodies and their medical
treatment.

Ms. Lieberman said that, while the civil liberties union supported
voluntary flu vaccination, the “societal interest” being advanced by
compulsory vaccination was dubious, since the state regulation
conflicted with both international and national policy on the
vaccination of health care workers.

Neither the World Health Organization nor the Centers for Disease
Control and Prevention has called for mandatory vaccination, she
pointed out.

Ms. Lieberman stopped short of saying that the civil liberties union
would sue over the requirement, which was adopted by the state’s
Health Department as an emergency regulation in August. State health
officials said Tuesday that the regulation affected 500,000 health
care workers and volunteers statewide.

Her testimony came a day before a judge in State Supreme Court in
Manhattan was to hear a lawsuit filed by a nurse in Poughkeepsie,
Suzanne Field, seeking to overturn the regulation.

In her lawsuit, filed a week ago, Ms. Field argues that the regulation
is arbitrary and capricious because no other state is ordering
mandatory vaccination despite concern about the H1N1 pandemic.

“It’s up to the Legislature to invoke such broad and sweeping police
power,” Ms. Field’s lawyer, Patricia Finn, said Tuesday.

Some legislators, including Assemblyman Rory I. Lancman, chairman of
the subcommittee on workplace safety, questioned the order to
vaccinate workers, especially in light of what Mr. Lancman called the
“relatively mild nature” of the H1N1 virus for most people infected.

“Before I can support the government ordering people to inject
medicine into their bodies, I want to see clear and convincing
evidence that the vaccine will be safe and effective for each
individual taking it, and necessary to protect human life,” Mr.
Lancman, a Queens Democrat, said after the hearing.

Both federal and state health authorities have said the H1N1 vaccine
is made using the same protocols as seasonal vaccine and is safe.

Susan Waltman, general counsel for the Greater New York Hospital
Association, said Tuesday that a shortage of seasonal flu vaccine,
coupled with slow delivery of the newly developed H1N1 vaccine, had
undermined the ability of hospitals to vaccinate their workers by the
state’s Nov. 30 deadline.

Several labor unions have opposed compulsory flu vaccination, arguing
that it could result in the punishment and even dismissal of workers
who refuse, whether for religious, cultural or other reasons, to be
vaccinated.

The regulation covers workers and volunteers who come into direct
contact with patients, including nurses, doctors and aides and even
nonmedical staff members like food service workers if they enter a
patient’s room, according to the state Health Department.

[END OF QUOTE]

=====================================

"...punishment and even dismissal of workers who refuse, whether for
religious, cultural or other reasons, to be vaccinated."

??? ...........after all this time, still not one word about citizens
refusing to be vaccinated on the ground that modern medicine is not
science but is only a religion, and that anyone who says vaccines
benefit us is making such statements solely on a basis of religious
faith......

Did Hans Ruesch and Robert Mendelsohn live their lives in vain?
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-15 22:19:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
Post by Westprog
He is right though. It will be possible to spot the stupid people when the
vaccines are on offer.
------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/14/health/policy/14vaccine.html
Mandatory Flu Vaccination for N.Y. Health Workers Is Criticized
Published: October 13, 2009
The New York Civil Liberties Union demanded on Tuesday that the state
health commissioner withdraw a new regulation requiring hundreds of
thousands of health care workers to get both seasonal and swine flu
vaccinations.
In testimony before several State Assembly committees in Lower
Manhattan, Donna Lieberman, executive director of the civil liberties
union, said that the requirement violated the constitutional right of
health care workers to control their bodies and their medical
treatment.
Ms. Lieberman said that, while the civil liberties union supported
voluntary flu vaccination, the “societal interest” being advanced by
compulsory vaccination was dubious, since the state regulation
conflicted with both international and national policy on the
vaccination of health care workers.
Neither the World Health Organization nor the Centers for Disease
Control and Prevention has called for mandatory vaccination, she
pointed out.
Ms. Lieberman stopped short of saying that the civil liberties union
would sue over the requirement, which was adopted by the state’s
Health Department as an emergency regulation in August. State health
officials said Tuesday that the regulation affected 500,000 health
care workers and volunteers statewide.
Her testimony came a day before a judge in State Supreme Court in
Manhattan was to hear a lawsuit filed by a nurse in Poughkeepsie,
Suzanne Field, seeking to overturn the regulation.
In her lawsuit, filed a week ago, Ms. Field argues that the regulation
is arbitrary and capricious because no other state is ordering
mandatory vaccination despite concern about the H1N1 pandemic.
“It’s up to the Legislature to invoke such broad and sweeping police
power,” Ms. Field’s lawyer, Patricia Finn, said Tuesday.
Some legislators, including Assemblyman Rory I. Lancman, chairman of
the subcommittee on workplace safety, questioned the order to
vaccinate workers, especially in light of what Mr. Lancman called the
“relatively mild nature” of the H1N1 virus for most people infected.
“Before I can support the government ordering people to inject
medicine into their bodies, I want to see clear and convincing
evidence that the vaccine will be safe and effective for each
individual taking it, and necessary to protect human life,” Mr.
Lancman, a Queens Democrat, said after the hearing.
Both federal and state health authorities have said the H1N1 vaccine
is made using the same protocols as seasonal vaccine and is safe.
Susan Waltman, general counsel for the Greater New York Hospital
Association, said Tuesday that a shortage of seasonal flu vaccine,
coupled with slow delivery of the newly developed H1N1 vaccine, had
undermined the ability of hospitals to vaccinate their workers by the
state’s Nov. 30 deadline.
Several labor unions have opposed compulsory flu vaccination, arguing
that it could result in the punishment and even dismissal of workers
who refuse, whether for religious, cultural or other reasons, to be
vaccinated.
The regulation covers workers and volunteers who come into direct
contact with patients, including nurses, doctors and aides and even
nonmedical staff members like food service workers if they enter a
patient’s room, according to the state Health Department.
[END OF QUOTE]
=====================================
"...punishment and even dismissal of workers who refuse, whether for
religious, cultural or other reasons, to be vaccinated."
??? ...........after all this time, still not one word about citizens
refusing to be vaccinated on the ground that modern medicine is not
science but is only a religion, and that anyone who says vaccines
benefit us is making such statements solely on a basis of religious
faith......
Did Hans Ruesch and Robert Mendelsohn live their lives in vain?
Yes, when they could have really enriched our world and written some
realy serious stuff about how venus was really the source of flies in
the biblical plagues and how this is proven by how in many world
cultures, venus is strongly associated with flies. I think they
wasted all their energy and missed the big picture.
Special Care
2009-10-16 19:47:37 UTC
Permalink
On Oct 15, 11:19 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
Did Hans Ruesch and Robert Mendelsohn live their lives in vain?
Yes, when they could have really enriched our world and written some
realy serious stuff about how venus was really the source of flies in
the biblical plagues and how this is proven by how in many world
cultures, venus is strongly associated with flies.  I think they
wasted all their energy and missed the big picture.
---------------

If you say that Hans Ruech, Immanuel Velikovsky, Robert Mendelsohn and
similar have not enriched human thought and have not prompted us to
move in the direction of healing, then there is an onus on you to
supply your alternative, to supply the correct healing formula.

What is your healing formula?

Is it just to render unto Caesar what is Caesar's?

["Caesar" now meaning the EU and what it will soon become globally,
joining up with the American Union, African Union, Association of
South-East Asian Nations, etc.]
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-16 21:50:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Oct 15, 11:19 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
Did Hans Ruesch and Robert Mendelsohn live their lives in vain?
Yes, when they could have really enriched our world and written some
realy serious stuff about how venus was really the source of flies in
the biblical plagues and how this is proven by how in many world
cultures, venus is strongly associated with flies.  I think they
wasted all their energy and missed the big picture.
---------------
If you say that Hans Ruech, Immanuel Velikovsky, Robert Mendelsohn and
similar have not enriched human thought and have not prompted us to
move in the direction of healing, then there is an onus on you to
supply your alternative, to supply the correct healing formula.
What is your healing formula?
All Bran and Gary Numan.
Post by Special Care
Is it just to render unto Caesar what is Caesar's?
["Caesar" now meaning the EU and what it will soon become globally,
joining up with the American Union, African Union, Association of
South-East Asian Nations, etc.]
Special Care
2009-10-17 16:55:59 UTC
Permalink
On 16 Oct, 22:50, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
On Oct 15, 11:19 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
Did Hans Ruesch and Robert Mendelsohn live their lives in vain?
Yes, when they could have really enriched our world and written some
realy serious stuff about how venus was really the source of flies in
the biblical plagues and how this is proven by how in many world
cultures, venus is strongly associated with flies.  I think they
wasted all their energy and missed the big picture.
---------------
If you say that Hans Ruech, Immanuel Velikovsky, Robert Mendelsohn and
similar have not enriched human thought and have not prompted us to
move in the direction of healing, then there is an onus on you to
supply your alternative, to supply the correct healing formula.
What is your healing formula?
All Bran and Gary Numan.
---------------------------------------------------------

Not a surphuric acid enema?
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-17 20:18:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On 16 Oct, 22:50, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
On Oct 15, 11:19 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
Did Hans Ruesch and Robert Mendelsohn live their lives in vain?
Yes, when they could have really enriched our world and written some
realy serious stuff about how venus was really the source of flies in
the biblical plagues and how this is proven by how in many world
cultures, venus is strongly associated with flies.  I think they
wasted all their energy and missed the big picture.
---------------
If you say that Hans Ruech, Immanuel Velikovsky, Robert Mendelsohn and
similar have not enriched human thought and have not prompted us to
move in the direction of healing, then there is an onus on you to
supply your alternative, to supply the correct healing formula.
What is your healing formula?
All Bran and Gary Numan.
---------------------------------------------------------
Not a surphuric acid enema?- Hide quoted text -
That sounds like a right pain in the hole.
Special Care
2009-10-17 17:01:20 UTC
Permalink
On 12 Oct, 23:01, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
Post by Special Care
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
The swine flu vaccine centers that will crop up all over the world in
the coming months aren't completely useless: They will provide an easy
way to identify large groups of really stupid people.
etc.
I take it this is what you consider to be mature, grown up
discussion.
Yawn, you are better when you talk about arses.  At least you seem to
know something about them.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I've done a good job by pushing a major Forbidden Subject out into the
open, which no one else was going to do, apart from a few obscure
psychological texts by the likes of Erik Eriksson, Wilhelm Reich and
similar, which no one ever reads now, and which don't say it as
directly as I say it - meaning the Forbidden Subject of *anal
eroticism* in the mother-infant relationship, which we ignore to our
great detriment in terms of psychological damage.
-----------------------------
As for the repetition in the earlier post, that is a sound therapy for
mentally ill people, to overcome the condition known as *scotoma* -
the therapy being to keep repeating to them fundamental truths which
they are refusing to process.
Augustus O'Muircheartaigh
2009-10-07 13:21:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
On Oct 6, 10:49 pm, "Augustus O'Muircheartaigh"
Post by Special Care
-----------------------------------------------------
They don't try to conceal what is in the vaccines.
So what is in them then?  You sem to be so knowledgeable about the
subject.
Post by Special Care
The original motive was to make money, as it became clear to the
medical gangsters that the human population have a deep-seated need to
be told what to believe by "experts," and a terror of thinking for
themselves, which is rooted in the forgotten survivalist emergences
which drove us insane in the first place.
So you do not believe that vaccines work then?
------------------------------------------------------------------
I read about what's in vaccines but it's so disgusting that I
preferred to forget it.
This subject is non-essential to my main emphasis.
I thought it was obvious that I don't believe that vaccines work, and
So, back to an old question then. Do you remember the infectious
diseases that used to kill large numbers of people when you were a kid
in Ireland. Many people have forgotten about these because they have
gone off our radar, such is their effective elimination in the West.
The two most famous are TB and Polio. These were scary diseases up to
1950s Ireland. By the 1960s, they were almost gone.
You pointed me at two blogs before, which tried to explain this away
with some lies and hand picked statistics. I ask you again to explain
how these diseases were so common in 1940s and 1950s Ireland that
almost every street had people who fell victim to them. Vaccination
was introduced in the 1950s and now they are almost unknown in Ireland
(since vaccination in fact). In my family alone, I had two relatives
with polio and one with TB.
This disappearance of the disease is a coincidence? You think all
that vaccination was a waste of time? YOu believe these wank blogs
written by loonies and consider the official sources to be controlled
by "the ruling group"?

I can also mention measles, whooping cough, diptheria etc. etc. which
huge numbers of kids got in the 1950s but which are now almost absent,
EXCEPT, for the recent cases of families who chose to not have their
kids vaccinated. You claimed that this is a great conspiracy (by
ruling groups and lizards) to deny you your freedom. Yet, the very
increases in these diseases recently was due to parents choosing to
not vaccinate. Vaccinated kids do not get measles.
Post by Special Care
I have that first-hand experience of seeing my baby's progress at
developing life skills suddenly coming to a halt at the time of
vaccination, when nothing else had changed, so the vaccines were the
cause. That can only signify damage to the brain, luckily not severe
in this case. I took the time to keep meticulous records of his
development. If other families did the same, I would expect similar
observations.
The original post here was not primarily about whether vaccines work
or not, but referred to the fact that if we no longer have any say or
any right to refuse whatever substances government officials want to
inject into our bodies and our babies' bodies, then we have lost such
a fundamental freedom that we may as well just lie down where we stand
and wait for death to come to us - because we are as good as dead if
we give other people the power to inject whatever they like into our
bodies and our babies' bodies. You surrender your soul as well as your
body if you let them take that power over you.
And the fact that no serious or effective resistance is being offered
to that plan is indicative of collective mental impairment, which in
turn becomes intelligible and understandable if we think clearly about
*the psychology of the survivalist emergency* - which is where our
mental impairment comes from.
Governments have no power except the power you let them take from you.
But they know we have a deep-seated need to be dictated to, because
full-scale dictatorship long ago became associated in our brains and
in our archetypes with physical survival.
Seth
2009-10-17 22:24:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Special Care
No. The geological record, which nobody disputes,
Which record is that?
Post by Special Care
shows repeated
destructions of the surface of the earth in recent millennia, of such
a scale of violence and devastation that could only have been caused
by a sudden shifting of the earth's polar axis,
"could only have been caused by" is not proof, nor even widely agreed
on.
Post by Special Care
for example Siberia
suddenly freezing over to preserve torrid zone animals under the newly
formed ice in mummified form,
Freezing doesn't mummify.
Post by Special Care
which in turn could only have been
caused by the presence of a full-sized planet passing close to earth.
If that's what you think must have been the cause, that's your
belief. It certainly isn't something that "nobody disputes"; sane
people dispute it.
Post by Special Care
I've said vaccination is not my emphasis, and you are demonstrating
why I don't want to get into that.
Because you hate being proven wrong.
Post by Special Care
I want to concentrate on identifying core essential truths which are
beyond debate (except by saboteurs).
So you define anybody disproving your claims that way, right?
Post by Special Care
The advantage there is that the infiltrators/saboteurs will
immediately reveal themselves by their futile attempts to discredit
core essential truths.
Yup.
Post by Special Care
Wikipedia is wide open to infiltration and sabotage, as demonstrated
recently by the sneaky removal of the factual references I had added
there,
For a value of "factual" not present in the actual world.
Post by Special Care
So quoting Wikipedia is not a reliable guide to truth.
Nobody ever claimed it was, did they? (Or did you make that claim
until it stopped supporting your points?)

Seth
Seth
2009-10-17 22:21:23 UTC
Permalink
To you, anyway.
Post by Special Care
What effect did the Salk vaccine have on the polio epidemic?
It seems to have eliminated it.
Post by Special Care
Listed
below are public health statistics (U.S. Public Health Reports) from
the four states which adopted compulsory vaccination, and the figures
1958: 119 cases of polio before compulsory shots
1959: 386 cases of polio after compulsory shots
2000-2008: 0 cases.
Post by Special Care
Those are official public health department figures.
If you investigate similar public health records in Ireland or
anywhere else, you should expect to find the same pattern,
You can expect anything you want, especially over a 2-year period
(with a lot of noise in the data).
Post by Special Care
Remember, vaccines are by definition poisons.
Not by any sane definition (at least, they aren't poisons to _humans_).
Post by Special Care
The very
purpose of vaccines is always to poison you and your babies.
Are you speaking to the other germs reading these newsgroups?
Post by Special Care
Vaccines
exist only because there is money to be made from them. There is not
much money to be made from a healthy population.
There is plenty of money to be made keeping people healthy. Healthy
people are more productive, hence can spend more to stay healthy than
sick people can to become healthy.

Seth
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